[OFN?] Pentagon Approves production of F-35

[vaya]

the plane is too expensive

 

[Doaln]

the plane is too expensive

it's only like $45 miillion, $60 million, $55 million a pop or something (A, B, C version).

 

[Kurayami]

Do you really think China, India, et-all can get all of this together and use it in a coordinated manner? Our ridiculous military budget allows constant practice for these sorts of things while other nations have issues with that whole FOOD thing.

And yet the US does not have the best trained military in the world. The Israelis have better pilots. The British have better special ops. Several European nations rank ahead of the US as far as infantry effectiveness is concerned (as I recall, anyway.)

China and India in particular have been doing a large amount of military spending. If you want to ignore this, feel free, but each year the Indians are buying more modern equipment and the Chinese are getting closer to producing domestic designs on par with the west. Both countries take the matter pretty seriously and both do put a lot of effort into training.

Pure politics. Yeah, lets take away the F4's BVR advantage and also NOT give it a gun. Brilliant. Not that the Aim-7 was even a remotely accurate, but if allowed to stay BVR the F4's could spam them all day long.

It was more than politics. It was a lack of training and an excess of overconfidence on the part of the US military, which is something that has begun to creep back into American military doctrine since the collapse of the USSR. See: Iraq Attaq II

Have any modern Russian jets actually been tested to their 'full ability'?

That depends upon what you consider to be "modern." The MiG-21 is the most widely used fighter in the world. It exists in dozens of configurations, including some with modern avionics suites. The Su-25 is also well proven.

The MiG-29 and Su-27 series pretty much found themselves in the same role as their American counterparts. They have yet to engage a comparable foe.

 

[Kurayami]

it's only like $45 miillion, $60 million, $55 million a pop or something (A, B, C version). I could be flipping the A and C version pricing though.

F-35A: $44.8 million
F-35B: $54.0-61.1 million
F-35C: $55.0-61.0 million

And for people whining about cost:

F-15C: $43 million
F-15E: $55 million
F-16C/D: $26.9 million
F/A-18A/C: $39.5 million
F/A-18E/F: $60 million
F-22: $178 million (possibly $110 million by 2010)

Furthermore, the F-35 will be much cheaper to maintain than all current aircraft. Anybody concerned about military spending should be 100% behind the JSF project since it's the first project in 50 years that has attempted to curb rising costs.

 

[fiendish]

i went to see the F-22 raptors yesterday (Thurs) @ their first landing at a civilian field but all i saw were F-15s (that some people thought were Raptors) and my car was nearly destroyed


and the Raptors came in Friday le sigh. I might try and make it out there but I don't think I'll be ablke to make it :\ Friend might be grabbin' some nice pics though. She god a little mad at me for leaving the flightline to check and see if my car was a casualty Would have been if the wind wasn't as strong or in any other direction.

Saw them today. Thrust vectoring/flybywire/beinganf22 was a sight to see. Man-ooverability was awesome but holy shit it was loud

 

[Satan-]

Or I'm simply objective and am not blindly patriotic.

Where did I say anything about the Su-35?

Not really. The Israelis went up largely against poorly equipped nations (and did it with western backing.)

There has not been a true conflict between first world nations since WW2.

I'm not blindly patriotic either but I do recognize proven combat records.

You praise Russian equipment in your sleep.

So you're trying to tell me the Soviet Bloc wasnt backing the many arab states that attacked Israel time and time again your kidding yourself. Israel fucking demolished the Russian equipped/backed armies of the arab states (Egypt, Syria, Jordan).

Not bothering to seperate the quotes as I just got home and its late

 

[Kurayami]

You praise Russian equipment in your sleep.

Which must be why I say that Russian LRMs are shit, that Russian avionics are shit and far behind the west's, and that Russian EW packages are generally vastly inferior.

I am objective.
You don't seem to be.

 

[Evil Engineer]

I see your M1 Abrams and raise you...

Dimensions:

Total Height: 22.5 m
Total Length: 41.1 m (w/ barrels)
22.1 m (w/o barrels)
Total Breadth: 24.0 m
Weight: 243.3 metric tons (unloaded)
285.5 metric tons (with ammunition)
Maximum running speed : 41 kph.
Maximum rolling speed : 52 kph.

Armament:

4 x Vickers mk6 406 mm autoloading, liquid fueled, liquid cooled cannons. The cannons, mounted on top of the mecha, can fire 1125 kg high-explosive (HE), 1300 kg armor-piercing (AP), 987 kg anti-aircraft (AA) or 1254 kg nuclear (SPN) shells at a rate of one shot per cannon every five seconds. The maximum range of the main armament is 21 km on Earth with the mecha at 0 degrees inclination. If the destroid is standing on an inclined surface, elevation of the barrels will be increased and the maximum range will be larger. At the optimum angle the maximum range will exceed 50 km, though accuracy will be limited at that range. The cannons can also fire directly at the enemy if there is a line-of-sight. The shell room can house 28 rounds.

2 x Raytheon LSSN-20G triple-tube long-range missile launchers built into the arms. Each tube can carry:
2x RMS-1 "Angel Of Death" nuclear stand-off missiles. The missiles have a reaction warhead (200 kT) and a range of 250 km at Mach 4.0 in the atmosphere. They are however optimised for space use, where they have a delta-v of 4.1 kps. Guidance is by multi-spectrum imager and active radar homing.
or 2x Firebird missiles. This missile has a conventional warhead mounted on the frame of a RMS-1 missile and a range of 180 km when fired from zero speed and altitude. It has a maximum speed of Mach 6.5, and is guided by a combined IIR and active/passive radar seeker

 

[TseTse]

F-35A: $44.8 million
F-35B: $54.0-61.1 million
F-35C: $55.0-61.0 million

And for people whining about cost:

F-15C: $43 million
F-15E: $55 million
F-16C/D: $26.9 million
F/A-18A/C: $39.5 million
F/A-18E/F: $60 million
F-22: $178 million (possibly $110 million by 2010)

Furthermore, the F-35 will be much cheaper to maintain than all current aircraft. Anybody concerned about military spending should be 100% behind the JSF project since it's the first project in 50 years that has attempted to curb rising costs.

These figures are really mind-blowing when you think about it.

I wonder if historians will consider the people making raw profit from our military expenditures "patriots" after american is no longer #1 in the world in all matters.

I believe in the free-market but this stuff is staggering in terms of raw costs.