Post WOTLK Powerful Classes?

Give everyone blue PvP gear around Savage quality and disable PvE gear in arena.

Ta-da! Arena doesn't suck as much anymore.

Damage would still need to be adressed though, it'll be out of control even at 800+ resil.
 
--chaingun said:
Healing is not useless at all if you're any good at it.

Cheese is pretty OP right now but it's not unbeatable if the cheesers aren't any good. My shaman partner with 100 resilience who just hit 80 the day after the season started can last a good while; I just have to peel for him more than I normally would with a shaman partner.

I'm starting to think it's actually going to be a lot better with resil. I still don't think it's as good as S4 balance but meh, after playing a bit more it's just a lot harder, but not impossible.

I sure fucking wish I was a mage right now though :p
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My shaman does way better as enhance with ghost wolf zerg

with shaman mage we just conjure pets and blast something at the start, anything but pallies die.

especially with the new arenas that give no chance for LOS
 
Pretty much the only way to fix and make everything perfectly balanced is make WoW: Arena Edition and then they can tweak pve and pvp separately - not to mention making everyone happy.
 
--chaingun said:
The difference between S3 and S4 weapons was not significant enough to justify attributing the inability to hit 2050 to gear. Comp is also a weak argument at that rating level...you don't see that mattering until 2200+ when most teams aren't making stupid mistakes. The field was level last time. There was no "glass ceiling" created by the weapons.
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Smaq's experience lies mostly (in our guild anyway) with what Jiv and I did in S3 and S4.

In S3, we got to 2050 and consequently quit arena after that rating (when we got shoulders). We did this in S1 gear.

In S4, we rerolled (I rerolled rogue) and had mostly S2 gear. The S2 -> S4 gap is pretty damn large as was the S1 -> S3 gear.

We probably played about 150 games in S3 and 200+ in S4 as rogue/druid.

Catching up in s4 as an S2 rogue was pretty damn hard, I'll admit. then again, we didn't play Arena nearly as much as Arena players. I'm sure if we had coordinated a bit more and had a bit more experience, we could have beaten some nasty Warlock/Druid comps that we lost to quite often.

Catching up in both seasons, gear was the major factor. I'm not saying we would have been 2400 or a top 10 arena team, but we certainly lost a lot matches to gear alone.
 
AdreNaLiNe said:
Smaq's experience lies mostly (in our guild anyway) with what Jiv and I did in S3 and S4.

In S3, we got to 2050 and consequently quit arena after that rating (when we got shoulders). We did this in S1 gear.

In S4, we rerolled (I rerolled rogue) and had mostly S2 gear. The S2 -> S4 gap is pretty damn large as was the S1 -> S3 gear.

We probably played about 150 games in S3 and 200+ in S4 as rogue/druid.

Catching up in s4 as an S2 rogue was pretty damn hard, I'll admit. then again, we didn't play Arena nearly as much as Arena players. I'm sure if we had coordinated a bit more and had a bit more experience, we could have beaten some nasty Warlock/Druid comps that we lost to quite often.

Catching up in both seasons, gear was the major factor. I'm not saying we would have been 2400 or a top 10 arena team, but we certainly lost a lot matches to gear alone.
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Ok, but even with S2 gear, if you were capable of 2050 s3 you should at least be able to manage something in the 1850-2k range s4 with the s2 gear...meaning you should at least be able to get enough points each week to start making up for the gap. 4/5 S4 with an s3 weapon was more than enough to compete s4.

At any rate I don't buy it at all...the gap wasn't that big of a deal, but that really isn't the point of this thread at all and I don't see any point of arguing about it.
 
TonyElTigre said:
My shaman does way better as enhance with ghost wolf zerg

with shaman mage we just conjure pets and blast something at the start, anything but pallies die.

especially with the new arenas that give no chance for LOS
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Oh ok, well I agree that selling out and whoring a cheese comp like that would be more effective than healing, but I would like to reiterate that by no means is healing useless.

And Iczer...don't worry about it, by the time S8 rolls around, they'll have their shit together and everything will be balanced...just in time for the next xpack to break everything again.
 
icZer said:
Pretty much the only way to fix and make everything perfectly balanced is make WoW: Arena Edition and then they can tweak pve and pvp separately - not to mention making everyone happy.
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Optimistic and unrealistic. It should already be common knowledge WoW is a PvE game through and through. And they simply threw in PvP more or less as a last minute addition. I don't believe they have any real plans to "fix" PvP or give it the consideration players want. They already split the stats/mechanics for PvE and PvP so the same stuff behaves differently based on if the target is a player or a mob. So I'm skeptical they would attempt any kind of major overhaul or rehash to fix any arenas, world pvp, or BGs.
 
--chaingun said:
Ok, but even with S2 gear, if you were capable of 2050 s3 you should at least be able to manage something in the 1850-2k range s4 with the s2 gear...meaning you should at least be able to get enough points each week to start making up for the gap. 4/5 S4 with an s3 weapon was more than enough to compete s4.

At any rate I don't buy it at all...the gap wasn't that big of a deal, but that really isn't the point of this thread at all and I don't see any point of arguing about it.
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I don't think you're reading my post right.

In S3, we had S1 gear (with some PvE mixed in). We hit 2050.

In S4, we had S2 gear, we hit 1950-2000 (we could not break 2050 - actually, ran out of time to try). We were competing with teams in full S3/S4 and we still beat them.

The gap was huge between S1 + Sunfury Bow of the Phoenix vs S3 gear. The gap was pretty big going from S2 -> S4 as well.

The way I saw arena is there are 100% players, and there are "10 games a week players."

The really dedicated (100% players) would win with incredibly tight coordination. The rest of us, who are solid players but don't have the time to dedicate to hardcore arena fell in between the spectrum. The gear becomes much more glaring for these type of players. You can't make up for the points each week to make up the gap if you only play 2v2 as well. I'm certainly not complaining, but just stating that Arena in S1-S4 was more of a gear grind than an actual PvP thing for us. That is also why Blizzard try to address some of the issues with "PvE for PvP gear" as well as .5 set.
 
TonyElTigre said:
i dont consider doing what works, CHEESING OUT

but i guess if i was crying about arena's i would consider anything that beats me CHEESE
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I'm not crying about arenas--I'll be getting Gladiator.

I just don't think the current system requires any finesse or strategy for many comps. There are a lot of inferior players who are going to see ratings they would have never come close to in previous seasons.

And I've lost 2 games in 2v2 so far...both to good mage / rogue teams which is not cheese at all. Two retards will still have trouble beating people who know what they're doing, but the system is still flawed if morons who couldn't break 1700 are going to end up getting 2k.

But that's ok...if you want to tell yourself busting cooldowns instantly and focusing a random non paladin isn't cheese, who am I to stop you?
 
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Sean said:
When you say Mage, are peeps still going Arcane--or is Frost the preferred choice for the PvP crowd?
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In the long run, frost will be better IMO. For now though, I see far more Arcane mages just taking advantage of AP/pyro + AB and killing people in 2 gcds.

Frost will be superior still though...Arcane is kind of a one trick pony and while it'll still do a shit ton of damage, I find the survivability and control that frost grants will make it the best still.

But I don't play a mage--by no means is this concrete info...i'm just speculating.
 
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I would think your BG also plays into that, and variety (and how shitty blizzard made arena, lolburst)

Is Tich/Bg9 still considered the best? I thought it was all TBC, which doesn't mean that much right now, but still ;o
 
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