Thrax speaks in VUGames T:V forum
- Thread starter Hansel
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Zoolooman said:
I would at least consider that, although I still think it's crazy this was even brought up as an important issue. It's like people want to change Tribes just for the sake of changing it.
If the reasoning's good, I'll try it. But I tend to think I'd throw 3-3-3 out just on principle, heh. I'd rather not have to go through 29 favorites to find what I'd need for that exact situation.
I agree that 3-3-3 is a bad idea. The only reason I would advocate 3-3-4 is that it gives each armor two spare weapon slots beyond the "given weapons" that the armor could carry. Considering the weapon selection of T1 and T2, two extra weapon slots has historically provided the best balance between variety and player diversity of loadouts.
I also believe that T:V should come with 12 favorites MINIMUM (one for each armor and pack combination). 0 - 9 and - = on the top row would make some good default keybinds.
I also believe that T:V should come with 12 favorites MINIMUM (one for each armor and pack combination). 0 - 9 and - = on the top row would make some good default keybinds.
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Zoolooman said:
i found that using the numpad was much better
0-9 and ctrl 0-9 gives you a big range - although i only ever used 10 loadouts
i also used /,*,-,+, for switching out grenades, enter key to bring up loadout setup. only gripe was that for t2, the - key doesnt work, you have to use the one near backspace.
RegisteredFruit
Veteran X
I hadn't thought of how much 3 weapons would hurt the HoF. They definitely need 4 weapons.
I made that thread. :]
I reconsidered two-weapon-lights after some basic testing, for two reasons.
Number of favorites:
If at all possible, people want to buy their inventory using favorites. Let's ashume all Tribes: Vengeance weapons are useful. Let us also ashume that there are three weapons unavailable to the light (the rocket pod, a yet unannounced medium-only weapon and the mortar). Let us ashume all the packs are useful. Let us finally ashume the light always carries a disc launcher. This leaves six optional weapons.
With the 2-3-4 system, the light armor has one optional weapon slot. With this system, a light needs six favorites to get a full selection of weapons. With packs included, this becomes 24 favorites.
In the 3-3-4 system, the light has two spare weapon slots. Now a player can get all weapon aspects in fewer loadouts. For example, while I might want a grenade launcher or a chaingun for chasing (two loadouts in 2-3-4), in 3-4-5 I can just have one loadout with both.
Technically, the number of possible loadouts increases. In the 3-3-4 system, instead of 24 loadouts, we need 60 to cover every combination.
Fortunately, the number of necessary loadouts effectively decreases, since a person can now get two weapon aspects in a single loadout. The math is simple. If we only allow a weapon to appear once in all the various combinations, then we can get all the light loadouts with all the weapons with all the packs in a mere 12 loadouts. If a person uses every weapon with every pack, we still only go up to 36.
All of this is horribly unlikely, of course. No person will necessarily use all weapons or use all weapons with all packs. In general practice (and in my experience) two optional weapon slots buttures that less loadouts are necessary to cover all likely weapon choices.
The better reason is the following...
In Tribes, a player fights in several different ways. They can be generally categorized as:
Tribes weapons emphasize one of these aspects. The chaingun is ground/air to air, the disc launcher is short range air to ground, and the grenade launcher is long range air to ground.
It turns out that three weapons are normally necessary for a full duel. The basic loadout (light with e-pack, dl, gl, cg) contains a way to fight in all three categories.
If you don't allow a player to fight in all of these aspects, then he will suffer terribly because of the restriction. It's better to give all armors equal access to Tribes combat, rather than to stiff the light simply to maintain a sort of beautiful heirarchy of weapon counts.
I reconsidered two-weapon-lights after some basic testing, for two reasons.
Number of favorites:
If at all possible, people want to buy their inventory using favorites. Let's ashume all Tribes: Vengeance weapons are useful. Let us also ashume that there are three weapons unavailable to the light (the rocket pod, a yet unannounced medium-only weapon and the mortar). Let us ashume all the packs are useful. Let us finally ashume the light always carries a disc launcher. This leaves six optional weapons.
With the 2-3-4 system, the light armor has one optional weapon slot. With this system, a light needs six favorites to get a full selection of weapons. With packs included, this becomes 24 favorites.
In the 3-3-4 system, the light has two spare weapon slots. Now a player can get all weapon aspects in fewer loadouts. For example, while I might want a grenade launcher or a chaingun for chasing (two loadouts in 2-3-4), in 3-4-5 I can just have one loadout with both.
Technically, the number of possible loadouts increases. In the 3-3-4 system, instead of 24 loadouts, we need 60 to cover every combination.
Fortunately, the number of necessary loadouts effectively decreases, since a person can now get two weapon aspects in a single loadout. The math is simple. If we only allow a weapon to appear once in all the various combinations, then we can get all the light loadouts with all the weapons with all the packs in a mere 12 loadouts. If a person uses every weapon with every pack, we still only go up to 36.
All of this is horribly unlikely, of course. No person will necessarily use all weapons or use all weapons with all packs. In general practice (and in my experience) two optional weapon slots buttures that less loadouts are necessary to cover all likely weapon choices.
The better reason is the following...
In Tribes, a player fights in several different ways. They can be generally categorized as:
- Ground/Air to air combat.
- Short range air to ground combat.
- Long range air to ground combat.
Tribes weapons emphasize one of these aspects. The chaingun is ground/air to air, the disc launcher is short range air to ground, and the grenade launcher is long range air to ground.
It turns out that three weapons are normally necessary for a full duel. The basic loadout (light with e-pack, dl, gl, cg) contains a way to fight in all three categories.
If you don't allow a player to fight in all of these aspects, then he will suffer terribly because of the restriction. It's better to give all armors equal access to Tribes combat, rather than to stiff the light simply to maintain a sort of beautiful heirarchy of weapon counts.
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one of the points the dev team seems to be making is that it wants to have every single thing in the game usefull, not just some thingsas in T1 and T2 currently, now a-s-s-uming that of the 11 weapons 1 is for light only and 1 is for medium only that leaves 9 weapons. also a-s-s-uming that the dev team manages to each their perfect balence and make every weapon useable, if the heavy was only allowed 3 weapons that makes 3 different loadouts with completly different weapons without even changing a pack.
i think that this is the biggest reason to leave the 3,4,5 for light medium and heavy respectivly. i believe that sojourn said he only ever used 5 different weapons as heavy (which is the same as me, but he has a bigger profile in the community), in which case haveing a heavy only carry three would be perfectly fine, but if they have a choice of nine thats only 33% (3 out of 9) of their total weapons instead of 60% (carrying 3 out of the 5 that are used).
sorry if this has already been said.
edit: stupid word filter
i think that this is the biggest reason to leave the 3,4,5 for light medium and heavy respectivly. i believe that sojourn said he only ever used 5 different weapons as heavy (which is the same as me, but he has a bigger profile in the community), in which case haveing a heavy only carry three would be perfectly fine, but if they have a choice of nine thats only 33% (3 out of 9) of their total weapons instead of 60% (carrying 3 out of the 5 that are used).
sorry if this has already been said.
edit: stupid word filter
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RegisteredFruit
Veteran X
buttume 
The filter is a little too strict.
The filter is a little too strict.
FireStarter
Veteran XX
Remember though, In T:V the deployables will be put in the weapon slots, rather then the pack slot. So with that in mind, only having 3 weapons for a heavy, might actually equate to having 2 real weapons while carrying around a deployable!
GIMPbeowulf
Veteran X
2 things...FireStarter said:
What's the source on that statement?
And what heavy really messes with deployables while fighting?
FireStarter
Veteran XX
GIMPbeowulf said:
The source is from somes of the IG devs in one of those "exclusive" ign or gamespot interviews. "The deployables are a bit different from what we are used to. They dont take up a pack space instead you have to pick up the deployable, take it where you want it to go and then set it up."
And for one reason or another, I find myself getting attacked quite often when I am deploying equipment. But maybe I am just a crappy farmer and leave myself too open.
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