spockhammer
AlwaysCrying
pedodemus with the pedo argument
Leftist Grooming: When is it too far?
- Thread starter ScooBySnaCk
- Start date
sehvi
Veteran XX
By for instance introducing these topics in a broad sense in high school? I'm not saying don't talk about it. Just keep it away from six year olds and let them explore these topics naturally together with their parents if they stumble upon them in life.
And let's not act like the rest of society isn't constantly reminded of related topics. In western society it's everywhere. Just to give you an example: hiphop (which has always been and still is very masculine) lyrics used to contain words like faggot and homo all the time now flashforward to 2022 and your rap career would get canceled for even using them as a slur. Things have changed. Things are changing, but you have to accept that these things take time.
Yeah, that worked out great for most of the people in this thread, didn't it.
Guess what. Those six year olds have relatives, neighbors, etc, any of whom could be gay, trans, whatever. If you're against teaching kids about things they're unlikely to encounter in real life, you should sooner be aiming at "what sound do farm animals make" before you come for gender.
And as for whether six year olds can handle these topics? What, you don't think they understand "boys like girls"? They don't look at their parents and see what's going on there? Do you seriously think that telling them "some boys like boys instead, and that's okay", is going to cause some kind of irreparable damage? Come on.
sehvi
Veteran XX
Yeah, that worked out great for most of the people in this thread, didn't it.
Are you really taking TW's populace as an example of general society?
Did I ever say this? No, I didn't. I would do that as a parent myself actually. I'm just saying you can leave this up to parents when children are young and leave it out of school up until a certain age.
No, you just said it's "a sensitive topic" without defining what that is or why it's a sensitive topic. You're not giving me a lot to work with.
Not that it matters much, because the point remains the same. Some people think that teaching kids about evolution is making them doubt the Bible and thus undermines all of morality. Does that make evolution a sensitive topic that we better leave parents to teach their kids on their own time?
Some people believe that saying 9/11 was done by terrorists is contributing to the globalist jewish coverup conspiracy. Does that mean we shouldn't teach that to kids because it's a sensitive topic?
Clearly, the answer is no. Schools should not cede ground to crackpot paranoid ignorant bullshit. The complexities of sexuality and gender are real things, and if you're really serious about treating marginalized communities better, then you should be supporting that we teach everyone to treat them better.
Not that it matters much, because the point remains the same. Some people think that teaching kids about evolution is making them doubt the Bible and thus undermines all of morality. Does that make evolution a sensitive topic that we better leave parents to teach their kids on their own time?
Some people believe that saying 9/11 was done by terrorists is contributing to the globalist jewish coverup conspiracy. Does that mean we shouldn't teach that to kids because it's a sensitive topic?
Clearly, the answer is no. Schools should not cede ground to crackpot paranoid ignorant bullshit. The complexities of sexuality and gender are real things, and if you're really serious about treating marginalized communities better, then you should be supporting that we teach everyone to treat them better.
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sehvi
Veteran XX
You can't teach / force groups in society to treat other groups a certain way. It's simply impossible. I personally am in favor of both social programs and education because I believe that for most people it will help them get a better understanding of differences in society. So yes, if I had a child I would teach the kid about differences in our society, but definitely gradually and not make a main concern. But there will always be a segment that won't align with it, be it due to cultural, ideological, or even genetic differences (i.e. being prone to certain types of behavior leading to the creation of in- and outgroups). The idea that society can fully be shaped into something is ludicrous and very outdated. Policy-wise that's very much an eighties thing.
That being said what I mean by sensitive is that it's a topic regarding sexuality and the fact that children belong to their parents whether you like it or not. Parents come with a subset of standards in life (which are the result of a very complex mechanism of socialization) and you can't simply just walk into their life and tell them how to raise their children when it comes to a sensitive topic like this. People have the right to raise their children the way they see fit as long as it's not damaging the outcomes of their lives. Yes I realize this is very subjective, but I believe the majority of the people out there want what is best for their children. I truly feel for the very small percentage of kids/teenagers being denied their identity, but honestly.. I'm pretty sure more than enough children will turn out decent even without being introduced to these topics at a very young age.
This being said I have to confess I've never really taken a deep dive into the science related to transgenderism, i.e. spending weeks reading up on publications. But from what I've seen and read I've never had the feeling that the science on this is settled at all - especially when it comes to the mental health aspect of it all. I'm all in favor of people wanting to transition or embrace their identity the way they want to and I think people should treat them with respect always, but there is still a lot of conflicting data out there and as far as I know, there are hardly any longitudinal studies out there because the field is still so young. It feels like it's in a very early stage so to me it's kind of dangerous to act as we should enforce (conflicting?) findings within the field onto a public aspect of a society that is far from in agreement on it. Especially when it's regarding a very small group within society and especially when there is more than enough space for the topic within the private element of society. Don't you think?
A couple hundred years ago, everyone thought slavery is a-ok. If we could buck that trend, then I see no reason why we can't make LGBT+ acceptance work.
You don't just teach kids about gender and sexuality so they can discover their own identity. You do it to make them aware and tolerant of other people's identities, so they don't grow up to be fuckwads like the ones on parade in this thread.
Do we need scientific backing before we teach kids it's not ok to make fun of someone for being gay or trans? How many papers would you like to see before you acquiesce to the idea that people shouldn't be judged for the things they were born with and can't control?
I remember some of my classmates in 3rd or 4th grade calling another boy a fag for wearing a chain around his neck. This was before the internet, mind. How many years and studies should we wait for before we tell kids like that that what they're doing is wrong?
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spockhammer
AlwaysCrying
does teaching ur kid about pedodemus include teaching them about ur my little pony fantasies when ur a grown adult U FUCKED UP NONCE
sehvi
Veteran XX
Pretty wild comparison don't you think?
Agree, but i also think you're taking it to the extreme by using TW personas (while we all know they act very different IRL) as the standard outcome for children not being educated on differences in society at a young age while there is still more than enough time to do so later in life.
You're acting as if teaching children not to bully is the same as showing them the ins and outs of gender and sexuality. I'd also like to add that kids are fucking savage in general. Even if the whole class is white and straight they'll still find ways to bully a certain segment of that class. Even though i very much agree that it sucks i don't think it'll ever go over..
We need to make these marginalized people (aka the mentally ill) feel comfortable by wrecking all the other childrens' minds so they can all suffer more equally together. And don't forget, even though the vast majority of "confused" children would simply grow out of this social delusion given enough time, that is now considered "conversion therapy".... so you as the parent need to get on board with hormone replacements and irreversible surgeries to fuck your kid up in the worst way possible.
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No, he's incapable of making that distinction.
How so?
It may not be the standard outcome, but it's one that should never occur, and I see no reason why we shouldn't try to prevent it.
Some kids will never be good at math. That doesn't mean we should give up on teaching everyone math.
You have yet to explain the actual negative effect that you seem to think teaching children about LGBT+ acceptance has, so I see no reason why we shouldn't do it, even if it won't work 100% of the time. And again, see the slavery exmaple above, I'm not sure if I even buy into the premise that it won't work 100% of the time.
Like most groomers, amadeus refers to the indoctrination as 'innocently teaching lgbtq+ acceptance'. We don't wanna convert your kids, we just want them to stop bullying that one trans kid that might exist somewhere in their county.
Meanwhile in the real world, the social contagion spreads like wildfire...
Meanwhile in the real world, the social contagion spreads like wildfire...
sehvi
Veteran XX
I don't think it will specifically have a negative effect on a majority of children at all. Like I said if I would have a kid I wouldn't have had any problem with them learning about differences in society. Have a few courses on it and be done with it. No problem at all. We had the same type of course in seventh or eighth grade (age 11/12) about why we live in a multicultural society and what the origins are of certain groups of people living in the Netherlands (i.e. the Indonesians, Surinamese, Turks, and Moroccans - some tied to our colonial past others to migration regarding the labormarket). What I'm saying is that gender and sexuality are for a lot of people controversial subjects especially when it comes to children and that I think parents have the right to decide whether or not their children get introduced to them at a young age or not. I'm in favor of state intervention, but at this level, it goes too far in my opinion. Especially when there's no uniformity within the state nor the science itself regarding the subject.
You're allowing the groomer to suck you into arguing false equivalence.
Multiculturalism and race has sweet fuck all to do with "acceptance" of a mental illness via enabling and encouraging its social spread.
