Did Jesus die a virgin?

PoorDoggy said:
His wife and kid(s) vote no.

Seriously, if you think a man in those days wasn't married by the time he was thirty, you'd have to be the kind of person who believes in fairy tales...

your joking right? there were several jewish sects before, during and after jesus that lived out in the wilderness without contact with females and on a strict diet. It was these jewish sects that some of the early christians started to imitate that then turned into monks living off in monestaries.

People like to say its total freakish for people not to be married back then because that is what the de vinci code says, but its total bollocks. There were groups of people livining in same sex communities, living lives of celebacy.
 
Jesus was a Nazarean Essene.

Essenes were one of the 3 major jewish traditions at that time. This isnt wacko shit... it's just stuff roman/protestant traditions arent comfortable with after 2000 years of roman/pagan lies.

His actual name was Y'shua or Yeshua. Jesus is the greek bastardization of his name.

The Essenes were a very orthodox jewish cult with ties to Mount Carmel area and the area of Qumram (where John the baptist, his cousin, was from and it's also where the Dead Sea Scrolls were found).

The Essenes organized themselves with a male leader and then 12 male temple followers. They also beleived Yahweh (god) has a female side and they also had serious female leaders as well.

Y'shua's father Joseph was one of the 12 temple male leaders at Mount Carmel. It seems Jesus in fact had a number of siblings, perhaps from Joseph's first marriage.

They were very much into messianic beliefs and saw themselves as the somewhat "true" priestly inheritors of the original Temple (they didnt beleive in the Second Temple of judaism). They also followed a seperate calendar than most jews, using a sun-driven rather than a moon-driven calendar. They apparently had ties to great mystic monotheistic traditions of egypt and also apparently had some contact with asian buddhism.

They believed in the ascension of the soul and reincarnation.

THEY ALL MARRIED... and Essene stories tell it that Jesus... Y'shua was actually married to Mirriam... aka Mary Magdalene.

This is also reflected in the various apocrypha gospels and gnostic traditions which break from the roman/pagan doctrines stemming from Paul's vision of christianity.

Essenes also apparently had sex rites, perhaps revolving around marriage and their somewhat radical views about messianic eugenics (i.e. they throught that through righteous reproduction and lives they could make each generation more pure and bring a truly heavenly Kingdom onto the planet).

Y'shua was a Nazarean Essene. He was likely married. He likely fucked his heart out.

We even have two "heretical" gospels which indicate intimate ties with mary... with one flat out saying they kissed and were married.

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There are major traditions outside the roman/protestant traditions which take very radical views... and even base them on original texts directly tied to the language of his day.

The picture you get from these different documents also correspond to what we find in the Dead Sea Scrolls, which is some pretty radical stuff.

And btw... nothing im talking about is taken seriously by The Davinci Code or by its mainstream critics. IMO that author just taps into some of the wider buzz and mystery, playing with more speculation than actual historical record.

If you dig deep into the gnostic and apocrypha stuff, you'll start to find some startling things... and notice some patterns.
 
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Beren said:
your joking right?

No more than your English teacher was when she wrote "F" on your papers.

there were several jewish sects before, during and after jesus that lived out in the wilderness without contact with females and on a strict diet. It was these jewish sects that some of the early christians started to imitate that then turned into monks living off in monestaries.

People like to say its total freakish for people not to be married back then because that is what the de vinci code says, but its total bollocks. There were groups of people livining in same sex communities, living lives of celebacy.

Which part of the Bible was it that said Jesus was a member of one of these hippie Jew tribes that lived in the woods?

Just relax and realize that in all likelihood, the dude was married and shagged his wife. So what? If you can't believe in the teachings of Jesus because he wasn't actually a magical being sent down from "Heaven" by some mystical "God" then your religion sucks.
 
PoorDoggy said:
Which part of the Bible was it that said Jesus was a member of one of these hippie Jew tribes that lived in the woods?

Just relax and realize that in all likelihood, the dude was married and shagged his wife. So what? If you can't believe in the teachings of Jesus because he wasn't actually a magical being sent down from "Heaven" by some mystical "God" then your religion sucks.

I'd ask you to show me where in the Bible it says to celebrate the Sabbath on the roman pagan "Day of the Sun."

Apparently you dont realize that "Jesus of Nazareth" actually was "Y'shua the Nazarene" or that when he met his "cousin" John the Baptist he was meeting up with a major fellow Essene from the dead sea community.

Or perhaps you didnt know that the early christians were generally called nazoreans for a reason? That this was an ANCIENT jewish cult going back perhaps to the early priestly sects of the First Temple.

And i think what Beren is referring to are groups like the Maronites who infact DID hide in the hills of the area and even exist to this day in Lebanon as a major cultural and political force. However, i dont think they hold onto the beliefs which they originally upheld and moreso follow an "eastern orthodox" tradition (which by the way has old testament books and gospels you wouldnt recognize because you read a more pagan/roman and western edited version of the "bible").

You also have various other semetic exiles who held onto the teachings of Jeshua but in ways you likely wouldnt recognize. There are christians in egypt, iraq, lebanon, ethiopia, iran, etc... and they often fundamentally most of we were taught as "christianity" as mostly lies and fabrications.

Ironically, Islam itself came from a tradition that accepted Jesus/Yeshua as the ultimate prophet and simple saw Muhammed as the final stage in a long-standing covenant with Yahweh/Allah... aka God.

But there were also many ascetic jewish traditions which would take up a more monkish idea of a priestly class, as well.

This was less than a hundred years since the Second Temple had fallen. The ink on the "old testament" was still drying and debated. It was a time of many, many messiahs, prophets and general religious turmoil in the region.

The jews wanted a new kingdom... they didnt want a fake king or priest like Herod. Nor did they want the old Priests of the Second Temple.

Jesus, Y'shua represented mainstream backlash against the political and religious order of the day. The mainstream at that time were the pharisees who HATED the old ways. They hated the Herod system. They would eventually form a more community-driven "Rabbi" order which became Judaism as we now know it.

In spite of popular European lies and misrepresentation, what Y'shua apparently was saying was 100% in line with the mainstream jewish community of his day... just not what the assholes like Herod wanted to hear.
 
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TseTse said:
I'd ask you to show me where in the Bible it says to celebrate the Sabbath on the roman pagan "Day of the Sun."

Apparently you dont realize that "Jesus of Nazareth" actually was "Y'shua the Nazarene" or that when he met his "cousin" John the Baptist he was meeting up with a major fellow Essene from the dead sea community.

Or perhaps you didnt know that the early christians were generally called nazoreans for a reason? That this was an ANCIENT jewish cult going back perhaps to the early priestly sects of the First Temple.

And i think what Beren is referring to are groups like the Maronites who infact DID hide in the hills of the area and even exist to this day in Lebanon as a major cultural and political force. However, i dont think they hold onto the beliefs which they originally upheld and moreso follow an "eastern orthodox" tradition (which by the way has old testament books and gospels you wouldnt recognize because you read a more pagan/roman and western edited version of the "bible").

But there were also many ascetic jewish traditions which would take up a more monkish idea of a priestly class, as well.

This was less than a hundred years since the Second Temple had fallen. The ink on the "old testament" was still drying and debated. It was a time of many, many messiahs, prophets and general religious turmoil in the region.

The jews wanted a new kingdom... they didnt want a fake king or priest like Herod. Nor did they want the old Priests of the Second Temple.

Jesus, Y'shua represented mainstream backlash against the political and religious order of the day. The mainstream at that time were the pharisees who HATED the old ways. They hated the Herod system. They would eventually form a more community-driven "Rabbi" order which became Judaism as we now know it.

In spite of popular European lies and misrepresentation, what Y'shua apparently was saying was 100% in line with the mainstream jewish community of his day... just not what the assholes like Herod wanted to hear.

you dont know anything about anything

i'd pick your argument apart point by point, but i neglected to read it before i quoted it and started to reply and its too late now anyways since im about to hit alt-s in about 10 seconds
 
who the fuck cares.... it's all OFN that you all should get over... my god is greater than any old religion has come up with... their comprehension of the world was ... well flat to say the least.
 
mmelmo:( said:
you dont know anything about anything

i'd pick your argument apart point by point, but i neglected to read it before i quoted it and started to reply and its too late now anyways since im about to hit alt-s in about 10 seconds

Right, "i'd show how wrong you were if i only had the time."

Whatever, man...

Like i said... start by showing me where in the Bible it says to have Church on "sunday" instead of on Saturday.

Roman/Protestant bibles and beliefs certainly dont have all the fuckin answers and in many cases are based on complete bullshit. If you cant accept that, then... hey.. take a "leap of faith".
 
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Why am I not shocked at the increased hatred for organized religion, specifically Christianity, on TW? I bet people will find reason to start flaming Beren for his Christian beliefs now too.

Honestly, why do you people care? Move along and post about something else. Damn...
 
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