Tribes - The Learning Curve

KillerONE

Veteran X
The achillies heel of Tribes success.

You can argue physics, you can argue gameplay, debate over graphics, piss over scripts but what's the one REAL thing that keeps most gamers away from Tribes (besides Tribalwar)?

The Learning Curve.

We've seen single player campaigns, tutorials, "newbie" servers and the like in a attempt to acclimate new players to Tribes as we see it. Here's the fundamental problem for those approaches: It requires the gamer to consciously choose to "educate" themselves. The gamer would need to say, hey, Tribes looks cool, I want to learn out to play this game.

In my opinion, those gamers that want to learn how to play Tribes will do so by whatever means necessary. Reading FAQ's, reading the manual, looking for tutorials within the game, joining newbie/training servers whatever they can find to help them be a more proficient player.

So, that leads us to the vast majority of gamers that simply want to plop down in front of a game, click a few buttons, join a server and get immediate satisfaction. At the very least, these guys will look at a quick reference card or take a glance at the controls within the game to find out what to do. As a last resort, they'll be filling the chat hud up with "how do I..." questions till they get kicked.

The Solution: (Puts on flame retardant suit) LT/Spawn CtF. Now before you start with the flames and the newb calling, hear me out. We've already agreed about what the problem is with Tribes (maybe we didn't, but let's pretend we did) the learning curve. Now, let's strip out all the complicated procedures and measures that make Tribes what is Tribes and let the newbies focus the single most important aspect of Tribes, movement. LT/Spawn CtF provide this. It's a no frills way new players can get into Tribes with knowning little more than Jet/Ski/Aim/Shoot.

Of course we'll have our traditional CTF as the pinnacle of true Tribe veteran status, but it gives new players a chance to come in a see what it's all about, have some instant fun and then aspire to become a true Tribes player by joining the ranks of Veteran CTF (renamed for your pleasure).

LT/Spawn CtF is a blast. It's super fast-paced, easy to pick up and lots of fun. This is what we want new players to see.. just how fun Tribes can be without all the frustrations and agony of the long learning curve. This is just a "taste" of what Tribes is about, it'll leave them wanting more (Vet CTF) instead of them wanting their ground pounding Quake/UT/BF style of boredom.

I'm almost positive this is been brought up before (and maybe I brought it up) but I think it's a great way to package future version of Tribes (Ascension, Legends, Legions?).

Even if all it did was garner a few thousand gamers that ONLY play LT/Spawn CtF leaving the Vet CTF servers full of leftover has-beens of Tribes past, it keeps support alive for the Tribes we love, now coined, Vet CTF.

DISCLAIMER: This post is not an advertisement or promotion for LT or Spawn CtF and condones any action by a true Tribes player as what Tribes "should be". It is a guide or a path to what the future of Tribes can be by proposing a potential solution to the age-old problem of Tribes Mass Appeal (TMA): the learning curve.
 
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Would a simple gametype solve that problem? As you said, the largest factor in learning Tribes is movement. Movement in Tribes is a very precise exercise; the controls are not exactly forgiving (no air-control, mostly vertical jet thrust, etc). I would think that perhaps new players would run into the same problems regardless of which gametype they were playing.

What if there were a training mission that focused solely on movement? Something like a simplified version of Xtreme Ski? Or maybe a course or track that you would have to follow over terrain. I'm thinking beacon markers (land in this valley, follow this line) and checkpoints, etc. Maybe precluded by a short demo of someone running the route in first-person? Skiing is unfortunately something that is difficult to explain through text, but it's really quite easy to show someone visually. I think if new players saw on their screens what they should be doing, they'd pick it up very quickly.

As for those players who want instantaneous gratification... I don't really know what to say to that. Tribes is a harder game to learn. There's no way you can keep it difficult and precise, and make it easy (run&gun) at the same time.
 
A video would be a GREAT way to show players. Just an instructional video on movement with text on the screen to show how to manage the jets and ski button. It doesn't have to be just first person either. A wide angle shot of a person skiing would show what is possible. In Burnout 3 you are required to watch the instructional video for new modes. I don't know why such a device was never used in Tribes 2 or Vengeance.
 
Knuckle is right about movement. Seriously most folks new to Tribes freak out once they see a bunch of experienced players moving and skiing around all over. They just arent use to that, the jetting, the speed freaks them out. At the same time thats what makes Tribes unique, and most folks that take the time to "learn" will find it very rewarding. Once your hooked every other FPS seems slow and boring.

At least if you give some folks vehicles, defensive weapons, mortars etc, they feel they can take part and have fun. Eventually the more they play, the more they pick up on the jetting and skiing. The Missiles vs flares in T2 for example may have been hated by some veterans, but new players loved em and they were great ways to get them involved and excited about the game. Plus its quite unbalanced when one person in some situations can soley own a whole game, not just because they are experienced, but because their experience combined with bandwidth, interoperlate tweaks etc wields a serious inbalance. No wonder uber whore cappers hated missiles. It was one of the few times they couldnt just randomly join a pub and try to own everyone. Enough players with missiles, mortars bombing runs can cause you some damage, and boy is that an ego buster.
 
I started with Tribes 2, and the steep learning curve was evident right off the bat but at least I had the option of playing a viable defensive role. I farmed turrets and sensors for a while, and eventually moved on to other roles as I learned more about them. Overall, Base T2 seemed balanced enough to enable novices and veterans to play amongst each other.

IMO, T:V totally lacks that balance (serial base rape anyone?) and all the T2 mini-mods I've played have amplified what had been small imbalances in Base T2.


Cliffs: I'm one of those jerks who thinks Legions should be T2 with better graphics and no UEs.
 
Reality check:

T1 base got big (several thousand players) on its own. If you can market the same essential gameplay to the masses, there's no reason it couldn't attract just as many again. Quit forcing noobs to learn and let them figure it out on their own.
 
This simple solution to this is having large servers (64 players) and large maps.

New players will likely jump into these huge servers. Which is great because they get to have fun with tribes and can play around with things without really being noticed or targeted as a nub (easy to hide/come and go and you please).

Most vets prefer the smaller (32 and under players) servers where teamwork and skill prevail.

So you can see how this naturally separates vets and nubs which is a good thing.

This was another factor that killed T:V imo.
 
Amadeus said:
Reality check:

T1 base got big (several thousand players) on its own. If you can market the same essential gameplay to the masses, there's no reason it couldn't attract just as many again. Quit forcing noobs to learn and let them figure it out on their own.

In all honesty, the reality check is this...

The masses don't care for Tribes and it's gameplay, simple as that. It's a niche market that will always be a niche in the gaming world.

But, I think the niche can grow a smidge, by creating a more entry-level, fun based gametype.

Somethings gotta change though, we can't expect to do the same thing and get different results. IMO, it's the Tribes CTF gametype that's the problem. LT/Spawn CtF helps alleviate that, but I'm sure there's a better solution overall. Hopefully this dialog will help bring out some good suggestions.
 
LT is nice because it's fast-paced. You spawn and play immediately, with no stops at the inv station. I prefer base though, because I can't mine-disc in LT.
 
KillerONE said:
In all honesty, the reality check is this...

The masses don't care for Tribes and it's gameplay, simple as that. It's a niche market that will always be a niche in the gaming world.

But, I think the niche can grow a smidge, by creating a more entry-level, fun based gametype.

Somethings gotta change though, we can't expect to do the same thing and get different results. IMO, it's the Tribes CTF gametype that's the problem. LT/Spawn CtF helps alleviate that, but I'm sure there's a better solution overall. Hopefully this dialog will help bring out some good suggestions.
Apparently thousands cared back in 98/99, do you think that gamers have changed so much in the past 7 years that sufficient exposure couldn't bring in a least 1000 newbs?
 
WorstAim said:
LT is nice because it's fast-paced. You spawn and play immediately, with no stops at the inv station. I prefer base though, because I can't mine-disc in LT.


T2c cluster mod is ur solution. It's like T1 LT, just that u got 1 mine in the loadout. I always asked myself why that isnt included in t1.
 
Actually, I don't think the learning curve is that bad with Tribes once you get people actually interested in a concept that's inherently far from their normal FPS expectations.

The big (64+/-) servers with plenty in the way of bases and vehicle uses are great for newbies. It's how I learned to play Tribes when I was just a newb and didn't even know the button lay out. I had a ton of fun messing around and learning the lay of the land and the game was too big for me to really matter. As soon as I became tired of 1v1 aerial combat and getting mid-air'ed with discs I could move to piloting and then to base infiltration and then to defense. As I grew in skill I spent more time dueling and playing with smaller, but more experience player groups until I eventually got involved in the whole clan deal.
 
Amadeus said:
Apparently thousands cared back in 98/99, do you think that gamers have changed so much in the past 7 years that sufficient exposure couldn't bring in a least 1000 newbs?

I'm not sure what you're getting at.

You're saying, stay the course? Keep trying to make "Tribes" and hope people suddenly WANT to play a game that is quite complicated to learn, not to mention hard to be good at?

I guess I'm just not seeing where you have an actual suggestion to grow the game of Tribes and it's community.
 
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