What Happened to the Grand Scale?

J

JongyFong

Veteran X
What happened to the scale of Tribes? What happened to being stuck in a valley, and not being able to reach the top of a peak without DJ'ing or walking 1/2 way? In T:V i feel more like a big clunky robot in an average or nromal sized world, in previous Tribes games I felt like an individual player in a vast rolling environment with varying terrain, even on smaller maps.

I'm not so sure its map "size", because maps like Iceridge(T1) or Beggar's Run(T2) were generally considered small, but I never felt limited like I do so far in T:V Beta, and it has nothing to do with the OOB grid. I don't think just adding greater distance between bases will create that grander sense and initiate more teamplay.

The greatest moments from T1/T2 for me always involved the flag. Whether it was a last second snipe, 4 or 5 guys trailing a friendly capper when he had no health left, or deuling it out while a flag is in the field knowing you just need to touch up to save victory, the flag now seems inconsequential. That type of team-oriented focus is lacking, and I believe the scale is a main factor. The fact that you can grab the flag and jet home on all 4 maps in less then 10 seconds may be "fast paced", but it isn't any fun. Then the issue of fog comes into play. In T:V the visible distance is so limited that a player disapears in moments.

Tribes wasn't just about tons of action and range of movement, it was about a feeling of freedom and scale unmatched by any other game. T:V has lost this and I don't know if just adding more and different maps can get it back. Time will tell.
 
I don't remember ever being stuck in any cavern that I needed to DJ to get out of. Maybe the hill on hillside, but I could get to the top of that with one ski and no DJ.

I think the "lack" of feeling your getting is probably because of the different terrain. You're used to large, rolling hills. TV is offering you smaller, but steeper slopes. In the end you can get the same speed off of it, but you're not looking down from atop this really high hill.

And I was only aware of a < 10 second cap on Emerald, and maybe cavern as that map is kinda small. :shrug:
 
Yes, I can't remember being any more limited or "small" in T1 than I am now in T:V. Same with T2 classic. The only time I can recall walking up hills half way is in T2 base, which was sort of the way it was.

Bigger mountains, bigger distances, those would likely get you that feeling, and will certainly be done in community maps and maybe some irrational ones. As would time. I didn't get into the feeling of Tribes: Vengeance until I played it awhile, now I'm quite liking it.
 
You have to remember that when you played T1 for the first time you were pioneering into uncharted territory. There had never been a game like it before. TV is presented as a graphical upgrade. Sometimes when you get very close to prefection, it is difficult to upgrade the game without disturbing the perfection.
 
Hello Dave G, I mean JohnyFong :lol:

epic thread


I do see what you are saying though....the maps that I've played so far seem to be smaller than t1 (and certainly t2) maps, even though they may not be....I suppose because it's much easier to go faster in t:v than t1 and t2.
 
I can reach the enemy base in one leap in every single map. No skis or need to touch the ground. It's a simple point to point venture.
 
*Thinks of the old GreaTTribal war maps* Now those maps had scale mountains that felt like mountains. ski so fast and so long ,It felt like a ski run at snowbird. So real that when looking 5000 ft away it made a nice mountain veiw backdrop That YOU COULD SKI OVER TO AND UP OVER
I could go on and on about those maps they are unmached in scale.
But it just has to be seen to understand ,no words can desribe it. Maybe someone out there has seen these GTW maps. Awesome.
 
using jump pad, grapple, and e-boot its possible to go from tower to enemy flagstand on isle

edit: without touching the ground.....its also possible to hit the ceiling boundary of the map using the same method, heh
 
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why do people thing that size = teamplay? size in and of itself != teamplay.

also for the record on emerald you can probably pull off a less than 5 second cap.
 
enDless_Delirium said:
I don't remember ever being stuck in any cavern that I needed to DJ to get out of. Maybe the hill on hillside, but I could get to the top of that with one ski and no DJ.
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I don't mean you would actually get "stuck" in a valley, but there were plenty of spots where it wasn't possible to just jump+jet clean over effortlessly.

And even Isle may tehchnically be a large(er) map, but it still feels small and confined when playing it. I don't know what amount of expanse to maps can bring back that scale. Even if you seperated the Emerald bases by another 50 miles I think it would still be lacking the old tribes feeling of breadth.
 
As I have mentioned before, Dynamix/Sierra created the split in this community by following T1 with a decidedly non-T1 game. (That was buggy as hell). Some (not all) ignorantly hurl insults at the other group when in fact guilt belongs to Dynamix. This split has not only be a pain in the ass but has retarded the growth of the franchise.

T:V will do one very good thing. It will eliminate the split. T:V will never have the scale that was attempted in T2. And to many many people that is a good thing. For those that were attracted to this franchise because of it's attempt at scale you (we, I am one of you) have two choices.

1) hope that SS:2845 works, is fun and is 'populated'. (VU could kill SS:2845 by sitting on it when it is delivered to them. Hope they dont)
2) leave the tribes franchise for other titles. UT:XMP for example.

The result is going to be, hopefully, the elimination of the Dynamix split.

Listen people, you can only make everything worse by NOT doing something else. If you want scale, DONT stay here and cause trouble. Go to SS:2845 or elsewhere. (I'm hoping for SS:2845 but am following UT:XMP closely).

For those who want a smaller scale personal game - closer to cluster - like T1, stay here, shut up about the game and play. Sorry, but this IS your last game if you stomp it into the ground.

It's over. We need to go our separate ways. Dynamix did this, we didnt. But we need to face the facts. T:V is smaller, clusterlike. It isnt and never will be scale/combined-arms based. Lots of us need to move on.

P.S.
Just for the record so people know the basis of my comments.

I would have prefered T2 WITHOUT Dyna-Bugs and with faster skiing. (Nothing more) --- or V2 as a second choice. :)

It looks like Revenant probably wont play T:V.
 
JimBodkins said:
For those who want a smaller scale personal game - closer to cluster - like T1, stay here, shut up about the game and play.
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Wtf are you talking about, the scale was in T1 AND T2. I'm not referring to epic team coordinated battles, I'm talking about the feel of the maps and the environment. Even though T2 had more complicated offensive and defensive strategies it doesn't mean it was any better, and T1 was NEVER about just going off doing your own thing even in Pubs. Everyone was focused on the flag. I personally played both games a shatload, but you are right that T:V feels much closer to T1 then it does T2. Try going back to the old games after playing T:V for a while and you'll see its very difficult to jump right back to T2, but T1 feels a lot more natural.

The scope of Tribes has simply changed in T:V.
 
MaD_ReBeL said:
why do people thing that size = teamplay? size in and of itself != teamplay.

also for the record on emerald you can probably pull off a less than 5 second cap.
Click to expand...

That is a good point. But to split a hair, sorry, many folks say teamplay but probably mean teamwork. I think teamwork is more planned and organized than teamplay. (That doesnt mean better) Teamplay to me is a little looser - coordinating a HO with a capper on 'sight'. (Maybe more than that) It is still important. But it doesnt (probably) extend to coordinating havocs full of Jug coordinated with bombers, cappers and aircover (shrikes).

Teamplay is good and fun. :)
 
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