[current affairs] Surprising poll of american attitudes re: immigration

[SureShot]

Yup. Id like to see a study done on how much the cost of goods would increase vs. the actual amount illegals cost us tax-wise.
Im not saying that they cant be here... I just dont want them here illeagaly and undocumented. Give them a special work visa, make them exempt from the min. wage, and have them or the companies they work for pay something into the system. THere has to be a compromise that would work.

I kinda like that idea as a whole. Still need to increase border patrol because the illegals will still come.

 

[triple]

And what does this whole plan create? More people illegally coming into this country, because they know if they stay here long enough, they'll get amnesty from the bleeding hearts in a few years.

 

[TseTse]

Yea, the underlines section really changes things. btw, how do you prove they have been here for more than 5 years? Also, what makes you think they can afford to pay a fine and back taxes. It sounds good, but will never work like that.

Good questions... and undoubtably no easy answers. They are likely to have to show documents and proof, but agian... that puts pressure on employers who illegally hired them.

Yup. Id like to see a study done on how much the cost of goods would increase vs. the actual amount illegals cost us tax-wise.
Im not saying that they cant be here... I just dont want them here illeagaly and undocumented. Give them a special work visa, make them exempt from the min. wage, and have them or the companies they work for pay something into the system. THere has to be a compromise that would work.

Personally, i like the "guest worker" idea rather than focusing on a path towards citizenship. We just need to be fuckin honest as a society and start handing out more temporary working visas for these huge amounts of european, african, asian and south american immigrants.

In terms of accounting for revenues and economic impact, there are lots of studies on there. For me, the real issue will be what it means to bring in proper taxes for towns who are paying insane public costs without the rightful public funds.

And the other side of this is what it will mean on the industries who've REQUIRED illegal immigrants and uber-low wage workers... when they suddenly have to pay minimum wages, etc.

That could drive up prices in the short-term.... even stir up wide-spread inflation.

And what does this whole plan create? More people illegally coming into this country, because they know if they stay here long enough, they'll get amnesty from the bleeding hearts in a few years.

I doubt that. The issue is WORKING in the USA and nobody is going to just setup this so that new people can rush in. The "amnesty" argument is really just a special interest ploy to confuse and stir up emotions.

The point is... we have millions and millions of people working hard in the USA who have no means to work towards legal citizenship. We have such BS rules about mexico specifically and quotas, it's all designed around the interests of these employers who hire them. We wont literally have enough visas and green cards to cover all the JOBS.

It has to change.

This is about american jobs, like it or not.

 

[crouton]

Answer for the back taxes: $1000/yr up to 5 years. Don't try to do W-2 bullshit, just make it flat. Yeah $1000/yr sounds expensive, but YOU aren't a fucking illegal immigrant. $5000 for becoming a US citizen sounds pretty cheap to me, seeing as lots of folks are paying much more than that to get brought to the US illegally anyway.

 

[Uncle Silas]

thats an impossible "solution" because illegals arent just going to make themselves known at the cost of thousands of dollars. wouldn't a better solution (for them) be to remain illegal?

It's a tough call. American citzenship is highly valued, I'm sure there are a whole lot of people who would jump on this.

However, how do you calculate the back taxes for someone who has been getting paid cash in an envelope for the last 12 years?

 

[TseTse]

However, how do you calculate the back taxes for someone who has been getting paid cash in an envelope for the last 12 years?

You audit the employers....


(big, but arguably necessary ouch)

 

[Data]

That's not really surprising to me at all.

What's surprising is how you've once again managed to turn it into a Bush bashing session with your blatant partisan bullshit.

You know what? Fuck you.

 

[Uncle Silas]

You audit the employers....


(big, but arguably necessary ouch)

That would absolutely demolish any chance this type of legislation would have. Basically because it would hurt everyone. I'm sure they could come up with a simple way. i.e., 'you mowed laws for 12 years? Ok, average lawcare pay is ~$10/hour in your area...you owe us $17,057 dollars.'

 

[TseTse]

That would absolutely demolish any chance this type of legislation would have. Basically because it would hurt everyone. I'm sure they could come up with a simple way. i.e., 'you mowed laws for 12 years? Ok, average lawcare pay is ~$10/hour in your area...you owe us $17,057 dollars.'

Well... it's special interests & lobbying around these employers who've made this situation what it is.

We either face them or the problem just never gets solved.

As for long-term tax payments, im sure there will be means for them to pay them off slowly, etc. I dont think this is a case where they'd be able to get instant citizenship, but it's more a like a long-term process where they bust their asses, pay back taxes, show documentation... continue to work...

 

[VonTed]

Back taxes?! They will claim they were un-employed and we owe them more money from tax rebates they never got.

 

[TseTse]

Back taxes?! They will claim they were un-employed and we owe them more money from tax rebates they never got.

Then they get the boot back to mexico.

The whole idea is IF you legitimately worked for 5+ years (can prove), then you get new options... but that includes paying back taxes.

I think that's good for them... and also makes sure they WANT it enough to pay for it... and to take a real stake in this nation. It also puts heavy pressure on the businesses who've been getting away with murder... fuckin up our society.

 

[Feannag]

It's amazing how the logic of politicians are...

"Okay, let's spend taxpayer money to hunt down, catch and ship out these immigrants. Tack it on as a homeland security expense."

"OR... We could spend a little money, fill out some paperwork, give them citizenship and then tax them. Given us a revenue."

 

[TseTse]

"OR... We could spend a little money, fill out some paperwork, give them citizenship and then tax them. Giving us a revenue... to pay for the public services they use AND since somebody has to fill those jobs anyways"

Fixed.

 

[VonTed]

Like this will EVER happen! No way will we get a mass of people to all of sudden volunteer to cough up a large amount of money. Every liberal in the world will crawl out from their rock and cry unfair to tax the poor! Unfair!