Christopher Hitchens is going to tear Michael Moore a new asshole

ZooL said:
i'm sorta convninced that moore hates the USA so i guess its sorta evened out.
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I won't accuse him of this. While I don't like Moore, I believe that he loves America very much, but that his values are kinda whack, and he tries to mix his values with his love for America. I think he sees so much good potential in America that he tries to push people to his point of view by pointing out things that people don't like. While this might work for some people, most see it for what it is, which is sensationalism with an agenda.
 
blackie420rx said:
I won't accuse him of this. While I don't like Moore, I believe that he loves America very much, but that his values are kinda whack, and he tries to mix his values with his love for America. I think he sees so much good potential in America that he tries to push people to his point of view by pointing out things that people don't like. While this might work for some people, most see it for what it is, which is sensationalism with an agenda.
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I think Moore sees $$$$$.

More $$$ = more Twinkies!
 
Megaera said:
Michael Moore is the biggest waste of flesh on the planet.......his mother should have spat that night....
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:clap: :heart:

A woman after my own heart.

Edit: Holy shit that editorial is long. :eek: I read the first half, and he whiped the fucking floor with Moore's fat ass. It's all pretty much what I expected to hear.

God I hate Moore... :disgust:
 
Data said:
:clap: :heart:

A woman after my own heart.

Edit: Holy shit that editorial is long. :eek: I read the first half, and he whiped the fucking floor with Moore's fat ass. It's all pretty much what I expected to hear.

God I hate Moore... :disgust:
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I've read Hitchens other articles over the years. He spews alot more hate than his subjects, it's really ironic. The guy is english I think, nobody there really takes him seriously.
 
this article sounds more like this guy's mad that moore pissed in his cheerios than anything else.

Like this right here:
The same "let's have it both ways" opportunism infects his treatment of another very serious subject, namely domestic counterterrorist policy. From being accused of overlooking too many warnings—not exactly an original point—the administration is now lavishly taunted for issuing too many. (Would there not have been "fear" if the harbingers of 9/11 had been taken seriously?) We are shown some American civilians who have had absurd encounters with idiotic "security" staff. (Have you ever met anyone who can't tell such a story?) Then we are immediately shown underfunded police departments that don't have the means or the manpower to do any stop-and-search: a power suddenly demanded by Moore on their behalf that we know by definition would at least lead to some ridiculous interrogations. Finally, Moore complains that there isn't enough intrusion and confiscation at airports and says that it is appalling that every air traveler is not forcibly relieved of all matches and lighters. (Cue mood music for sinister influence of Big Tobacco.) So—he wants even more pocket-rummaging by airport officials? Uh, no, not exactly. But by this stage, who's counting? Moore is having it three ways and asserting everything and nothing. Again—simply not serious.
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complete crap.

While I haven't yet seen the movie, here's the three points put together in a non-conflicting manner:
1) the administration ignored or fucked up too many warning signs of 911
2) since 911 the administration has needlessly issues terror alerts across the US; like you really need to warn us when there's absolutely nothing we can do about it...or warn us in SF when the "credable threat" is for NY.
3) if we are as scared as we're supposed to be and there is a real threat out there, at least start funding homeland security and everything else at promised levels. duh.
4) and if the security checkpoints at the airport are supposed to keep such dangerous things like box cutters off airplanes, stop selling me liquids in glass bottles at the gate and giving me glass bottles of wine on the plane. duh.
 
cogzinofa said:
this article sounds more like this guy's mad that moore pissed in his cheerios than anything else.

Like this right here:

complete crap.

While I haven't yet seen the movie, here's the three points put together in a non-conflicting manner:
1) the administration ignored or fucked up too many warning signs of 911
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Hindsight is 20/20. I haven't seen the movie, but this point of yours is utter crap. US intelligence receives thousands of pages worth of information every day. Much of this info must first be translated or decoded or both before
the value of the information can be assessed. Because of the vast amounts of information that must be sorted through, it takes time for the most important documents to be discovered for their full worth. Even after you jump through these hurdles, you run into a huge bureaucratic wall. Pre 9-11 US intelligence agencies were very inefficient at exchanging their information for reasons of both legality and infighting. Even if prior to 9-11 US Intelligence had all information possible concerning the attacks, this info would be split amongst the NSA, CIA, FBI and so on. An attack like what we saw on Sept. 11 was not completely unavoidable. However, bureaucratic roadblocks and insufficient staff (Like not enough people to translate Arabic) is not something you can pin on Bush.
 
scy7he said:
Hindsight is 20/20. I haven't seen the movie, but this point of yours is utter crap. US intelligence receives thousands of pages worth of information every day. Much of this info must first be translated or decoded or both before
the value of the information can be assessed. Because of the vast amounts of information that must be sorted through, it takes time for the most important documents to be discovered for their full worth.
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duh. US intelligence is also the number one buyer of high tech in the world and has secret budgets. they have some very very sharp and very very paranoid people working for them. that doesn't change the fact they dropped the ball and admitted it.

Even after you jump through these hurdles, you run into a huge bureaucratic wall. Pre 9-11 US intelligence agencies were very inefficient at exchanging their information for reasons of both legality and infighting. Even if prior to 9-11 US Intelligence had all information possible concerning the attacks, this info would be split amongst the NSA, CIA, FBI and so on. An attack like what we saw on Sept. 11 was not completely unavoidable. However, bureaucratic roadblocks and insufficient staff (Like not enough people to translate Arabic) is not something you can pin on Bush.
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yeah, and they got slammed for that. it was unexpected and OMG surprising and whatever other words you want to throw in there, but that doesn't change the fact that it was a monumental intelligence FAILURE.

and everyone knows this.
 
cogzinofa said:
duh. US intelligence is also the number one buyer of high tech in the world and has secret budgets. they have some very very sharp and very very paranoid people working for them. that doesn't change the fact they dropped the ball and admitted it.

yeah, and they got slammed for that. it was unexpected and OMG surprising and whatever other words you want to throw in there, but that doesn't change the fact that it was a monumental intelligence FAILURE.

and everyone knows this.
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Then I take it that you no longer blame the Bush Administraion for ignoring warning signs. Where do you want to place the burden?
 
Moore has announced that he won't even appear on TV shows where he might face hostile questioning. I notice from the New York Times of June 20 that he has pompously established a rapid response team, and a fact-checking staff, and some tough lawyers, to bulwark himself against attack. He'll sue, Moore says, if anyone insults him or his pet. Some right-wing hack groups, I gather, are planning to bring pressure on their local movie theaters to drop the film. How dumb or thuggish do you have to be in order to counter one form of stupidity and cowardice with another? By all means go and see this terrible film, and take your friends, and if the fools in the audience strike up one cry, in favor of surrender or defeat, feel free to join in the conversation.

However, I think we can agree that the film is so flat-out phony that "fact-checking" is beside the point. And as for the scary lawyers—get a life, or maybe see me in court. But I offer this, to Moore and to his rapid response rabble. Any time, Michael my boy. Let's redo Telluride. Any show. Any place. Any platform. Let's see what you're made of.
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see, here he's just taking cheap shots. of course MM isn't going to be talking hostile people or appearing on talk shows right now. of course he has lawyers and fact-checkers all over the place. MM and everyone else knows he's going to be attacked and sued. if I was his lawyer I'd be telling him to shut the hell up and not give anyone any ammo, however innocent it seems. sure he could show up and refuse to answer hostile questions or get up and leave rather than respond with words that could become a liability...but that looks a lot worse than not showing up in the first place. duh.

we're in a political climate where anyone who speaks out against the present regime is accused of aiding the enemy...and you're criticizing MM for hiring lawyers? :lol:

nigga please...
 
scy7he said:
Then I take it that you no longer blame the Bush Administraion for ignoring warning signs. Where do you want to place the burden?
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OMG the child asks a loaded question!

see, because if you like MM or listen to him you must blame the administration!

and if it's the fault of the intelligence community it must not be george's fault! OH NO!!

there were signs and perhaps things could have been done, but the events on 911 weren't put together overnight and they weren't put together specifically as a grand fuck you to george...maybe to george's dad, but not george. 911 was cause by stupid policy decisions made by reagan and bush 1. 911 was our nightmares from the cold war coming home to where they were hatched having lost the enemy they were bred to fight.

the intelligence failure were the result of administrative neglect and partisan fighting for 8 years over a goddamn blowjob and OMG he LIED under oath in an inconsequential nonsense case noone cared about.

and in a few years time when a new batch of terrorists hatch and come home to roost who's fault will that be? Clinton's? because they hate our freedoms and the thought of a fat girl sucking dick in the oval office? Or george's, with his 20,000 reported civilian deaths taken accidentally in our rush for vengence over 3000?
 
cogzinofa said:
there were signs and perhaps things could have been done, but the events on 911 weren't put together overnight and they weren't put together specifically as a grand fuck you to george...maybe to george's dad, but not george. 911 was cause by stupid policy decisions made by reagan and bush 1. 911 was our nightmares from the cold war coming home to where they were hatched having lost the enemy they were bred to fight.
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You're a fucking idiot and have no concept of the beginnings of Islamic terrorism. It has absolutely nothing to do with Reagan, Bush, Carter, Clinton or ANY PRESIDENT.

The idea that they are fighting to free the Middle East from American influence and "Zionist domination" is a cover beyond covers. Even if we swore we'd never go near the Middle East ever again, and we told Israel to dissolve immediately, we'd STILL have the threat on our hands.

And hey, we were much more involved in the 60s and early 70s than we were in the 80s-90s under Reagan and Bush. We had solid diplomatic relationships with the SECULAR Arab governments in the Middle East.

Islamic radicalism took hold because Israel beat the shit out of the Arabs in three wars, and some felt that going zealot would give them victory! Powerful men seized on that idea which swept the area and now have taken hold of countries and terror networks... not for ideas.. but for money.

The root of the problem is that there are a bunch of people out there making a shitload of money milking the fuck out of the Middle East while yes men continue to tell Joe Muhammed that it's all Israel and America's fault their lives suck ass. Do some investigation before laying the blame at conservative.. or ANY administration. Clinton could have done more, but so could have Bush 41 and Reagan.

Our lack of intelligence began with the decimation of the CIA thanks to a committee I'm sure you know all about that took place after Iran-Contra. Thanks to that little fiasco, Congress had the intel community by the balls and successfully castrated our intelligence. You want to blame something American for this whole thing? Blame those congressional hearings.
 
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cogzinofa said:
OMG the child asks a loaded question!
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Child? Seirously... you got me there. Your wit is something to be feared.

the intelligence failure were the result of administrative neglect and partisan fighting for 8 years over a goddamn blowjob and OMG he LIED under oath in an inconsequential nonsense case noone cared about.
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Then you're talking about the Clinton years, and not this administration. I'm unaware of any distracting partisan fighting over a blowjob during the past 3 years of this administration. The question was a simple one, and you failed to deliever. Now it's time for you to think of another devistating comeback.
 
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