T:V Elfgun Returns!

bobotheclown said:
Nothing against KP, but, Tribes is about much more than just freedom of movement.

And we're talking about a weapon here, the ELF Gun. Restriction of movement comes with more than just the elf gun. All weapons have some impact on mobility.

Zoolooman, it's not just about what you think. There's more people that play the game than just you. If I were to list all the details that single Tribes out, in comparison to other FPS games, my list would be much larger than that.
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The other weapons merely redirect movement in a fashion that one can recover from. The ELF gun removes the ability to move in a fashion that can't be countered.

And when did I ever say that this was about what *I* think? Why the offensive ad hominem attack? Attempting a poison the well or something like that? This has nothing to do with my ego and more to do with the design of a new game.

Anyways, it is obvious that details don't equate to core philosophies of Tribes gameplay. Just by comparing the details of Tribes 1 and Tribes 2 we can see that they don't make or break Tribes game - the core gameplay features do.

To be complete though, you're right. That isn't all that is core. I'd probably add:

The sensor net and command map.
Varied mix-and-match equipment system.

These things are important centers to the Tribes gameplay system.
 
Killjoy- said:
just add elf nades instead
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Actually, to me, this seems a reasonable idea. As long as it isn't some sort of "permanent" EMPing or anything else that prevents energy regeneration, it would be balancable.

Plus, it could have a splash. Closer to the nade, more damage.

If there are multiple nades, it wouldn't be a bad secondary or tertiary variety for people to pick up and use.
 
Sp!nfusor Salad said:
TW has always considered itself the De-facto opinion of Tribes.... just the way it is clown.
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probably because tribalwar is filled with the people who have played tribes the longest? Don't you think that makes them a little more knowledgeable of the game than some random guy called bobotheclown?
 
KillerONE said:
The difference is, some people go the extra mile to explain and reinforce what they are saying.. not just saying.. "T2 sux."

Zoolooman almost always reinforces his statements with facts/information that is helpful for his argument. It's hard to side with someone that doesn't have some sort of basis of what they are saying.
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Change fact to opinion and information to opinionated information.
 
also if you nade to close you get yourself too.. kind of like the T2 conc gren... and it is way more balanced then using a lock-on gun like the T2 elf.

I think it is a good compromise
 
My god, the ELF gun was one of my favorite parts of T1. Yeah the T2 elf sucked balls because of it's range and all. As was already established, the elf gun is more of a tool than a weapon. If you get a good hit in, your opponent will drop to the ground making an easy disk shot. You can go right up to a turret, elf it for a second or two while dropping all of your grenades and destroy it. If you come up to a heavy in a tight spot, whip out the elf right next to him and drop all the grenades/mines that you can - dead heavy, no matter what. He can't get away because he has no energy and he's got no shields because you've been elfing all his energy away. You see an enemy trying to get on your roof? Elf him straight to the ground. Capper coming in with some other friendlies around? Get in close and make sure he can't jet off, or making him fall to the ground, missing the flag stand, then spam "VAV" and laugh as you watch him try to jet, but just not have any juice.

Replace that chaingun with an elf gun in t1 and actually use it in situations that I've described above. It's a helluva fun weapon, believe it or not.
 
If there was some form of elf I think the elf grenade is the best idea. I personally wouldn't miss it if it wasn't in the game though. And elf turrets are always good times.
 
bobotheclown said:
Change fact to opinion and information to opinionated information.
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I'm disgusted. You are a terrible debater sir. You don't even attack me or my points directly. Instead, you seek to subtly falsify my views and call their validity into question by insinuating that I'm using neither facts nor information.

To me, this shows that you have failed to come up with a valid response to anything I've said. Rather than approach me directly with your challenges (which I'm sure I can meet) you talk to other people as if I wasn't around, hoping to disillusion people into thinking that my facts and my information are somehow fabrications created by my desire to be correct.

If you have something to say about my points, you might want to approach them directly with factual challenges instead of skulking about slandering my name and attempting to hand wave my points into oblivion.
 
Rabid Poop said:
probably because tribalwar is filled with the people who have played tribes the longest? Don't you think that makes them a little more knowledgeable of the game than some random guy called bobotheclown?
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This is too funny to go unnoticed. Because I'm a new member here has no direct relation to how long I've been playing the game. I've played just as long as most of you, probably longer than most.

I still play T1 on a regular basis, as well as T2 and Legends. I think I've got more than enough gameplaying knowledge than what's needed to validate my opinions.

It's unfortunate you guys validate all your biased opinions based off veteran status and how much time you've known other players.
 
You calm that attitude down bobo.

You were the FIRST one to claim we only validate our opinions based off of our status. Rabid Poop merely said that experience does tend to give credence to the opinions or views of people. The more experience, the more credence. This isn't particularly false.

That said, you've been quite the jerk in this thread, attempting to imply that our views are nothing more than paper film held up by the scaffolding of reputation.

How about you approach me head on with points instead of weak emotional appeals or social attacks.
 
bobotheclown said:
This is too funny to go unnoticed. Because I'm a new member here has no direct relation to how long I've been playing the game. I've played just as long as most of you, probably longer than most.

I still play T1 on a regular basis, as well as T2 and Legends. I think I've got more than enough gameplaying knowledge than what's needed to validate my opinions.

It's unfortunate you guys validate all your biased opinions based off veteran status and how much time you've known other players.
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uhh I didn't say anything about member status, but way to pull the member card for no reason. I responded to salad's statement about tribalwar being the "de-facto opinion" of tribes.

When i say bobotheclown is some random person, I'm not talking about you being a member, I'm talking about you coming out of nowhere and making claims of what is best for the game without supporting evidence, just "say it's so". Not only that, when someone makes up a well thought-out post like zoolooman's, you respond with a stupid one-liner.

Anyone else notice that members start up the registration date issue more than veterans do?
 
bobotheclown said:
This is too funny to go unnoticed. Because I'm a new member here has no direct relation to how long I've been playing the game. I've played just as long as most of you, probably longer than most.

I still play T1 on a regular basis, as well as T2 and Legends. I think I've got more than enough gameplaying knowledge than what's needed to validate my opinions.

It's unfortunate you guys validate all your biased opinions based off veteran status and how much time you've known other players.
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We can't judge your knowledge of the game based on your member status. But for the most part, those that have been posting on TW for a few years have been playing tribes as well for that duration, so it is not inconcievable that in general the people of TW who have been around and been playing the game for years would have a very good understanding of the game.
 
JodoFett said:
We can't judge your knowledge of the game based on your member status. But for the most part, those that have been posting on TW for a few years have been playing tribes as well for that duration, so it is not inconcievable that in general the people of TW who have been around and been playing the game for years would have a very good understanding of the game.
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So because you don't hit TW to forum whore, your opinion should'nt be considered?

Zoolooman, Your posts are nothing more than biased rhetoric. If you think you have some point, summarize it and get on with your life.
 
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I said nothing about not considering your opinion, I was merely stating that someone being a vet on here means they have probably been playing the game for quite a while and that makes it a fairly good measure of their level of experience with the game.
 
bobotheclown said:
Zoolooman, Your posts are nothing more than biased rhetoric. If you think you have some point, summarize it and get on with your life.
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So are yours. Make YOUR point.
 
How pathetic. You consider my post biased rhetoric? Biased towards what? Which words of mine are rhetorical?

If you mean rhetorical by, "skillful in using language effectively and persuasively," then yeah, it is rhetorical.

If you mean rhetorical as, "language that is elaborate, pretentious, insincere, or intellectually vacuous," then you are most assuredly wrong.
 
bobotheclown said:
Removing all the aspects that make Tribes, essentially, what it is.

T2 added to T1, whereas, T:V is removing everything that made Tribes what it is and adding only a small amount in it's place.

Interested to see where T:V ends up.
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Don't be ridiculous. They aren't removing everything that made Tribes what it is. There are plenty of new features. You would know this if you actually paid attention.
 
The other weapons merely redirect movement in a fashion that one can recover from. The ELF gun removes the ability to move in a fashion that can't be countered.
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The same can kind of be said about bodyblocking. Seeing as it brings the enemy to a dead stop, it's hardly feasible to recover your previous speed any easier than having been a target of an ELF (unless the ELF manages to keep a lock on you, in which case the ELFer is fairly vulnerable to you shooting him). Of course, bodyblocking is quite a bit more difficult to pull off than ELFing, so they are not equivalent by any means. Since Tribes IS very much about movement, I think a weapon that attacks such movement is appropriate provided it doesn't get overused.

You made a couple suggestions on what could be done to ensure that the ELF is kept reasonably balanced, and they are all legitimate, but I think there are a couple more things that could be done. For one, the energy drain should not stack with other ELFs. That way, if you have enough speed, you need not fear getting your entire energy supply drained as you fly past 4 stationary elfers. I think more countermeasures against the ELF wouldn't hurt either. Perhaps pack energy would be drained before armor energy, and/or the elf could also be distracted with grenades in addition to mines.

Another idea that I think would be interesting would be if the ELF was vampiric. Instead of draining energy from the user, it could ADD some portion of the drained energy to the user's supply. This would be difficult to balance, but would add to the fun of the user while not affecting the fun of the victim overtly. Then instead of killing movement potential, you are merely transferring it from one player to another.
 
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