Californians might get a chance to vote on legalizing marijuana akin to alcohol. by Dumpy Dooby - Page 6 - TribalWar Forums
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Reload this Page Californians might get a chance to vote on legalizing marijuana akin to alcohol.
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ZOD
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101 - 07-02-2008, 02:39
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Eh well you don't really go out and just "Find" seeds right? You can't just go outside and find a female wild growing plant and pick clones..

so you would tax on sale.

seed packages can be per seed.

You could still get clones from friends, but the point is that there is a **** ton of people who would buy through the system and pay their tax just the same as there is some people who brew their own beer, yet the majority of beer drinkers buy it in a store..

because its "easier"
People don't brew their own beer because it's a pain in the ass. But growing a "weed" (pun intended) is beyond simple. This is like trying to collect a sales tax on used items, not feasible. So either there are going to be a lot of tax evaders or there won;t be any tax on person to person sales.

I guess a lot of people would just go to the store and buy a pack. Welp, hopefully they will have to deal with this issue. I am quite interested in how that goes.
 
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Shadow13
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102 - 07-02-2008, 02:44
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People don't brew their own beer because it's a pain in the ass. But growing a "weed" (pun intended) is beyond simple. This is like trying to collect a sales tax on used items, not feasible. So either there are going to be a lot of tax evaders or there won;t be any tax on person to person sales.

I guess a lot of people would just go to the store and buy a pack. Welp, hopefully they will have to deal with this issue. I am quite interested in how that goes.
you can grow **** weed, with **** yield and **** potency "easy". But good luck trying to grow medicinal / commerical grade weed as easy as you try to make it sound like.

Considering the cost of power in california, the cost of equipment, the fact that you are now a target for break in from people who don't want to buy it, having to worry about it if you ever want to leave your house.. and waiting the month for veg and 50-80 days depending on if its indica or sativa for it to flower.. Not to mention its still illegal in the eyes of the government and you are putting yourself at a higher risk growing then just smoking.

oh yea then you wait a week or so on drying, and if you want decent weed a month or two of cure time. Not to mention you have to get the cut/seed from somewhere.. then on top of it if you have a perpetual grow you gotta maintain a mother in 18/6 lighting or 24hour lighting which is even MORE money you spend on power bill.

Plus you get 1-2oz on a normal sized plant in most cases, and then have to do the whole process over again (Minus the cost of the equipment.)
 
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Last edited by Shadow13; 07-02-2008 at 02:49..
Reggs
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103 - 07-02-2008, 02:45
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People don't brew their own beer because it's a pain in the ass. But growing a "weed" (pun intended) is beyond simple. This is like trying to collect a sales tax on used items, not feasible. So either there are going to be a lot of tax evaders or there won;t be any tax on person to person sales.

I guess a lot of people would just go to the store and buy a pack. Welp, hopefully they will have to deal with this issue. I am quite interested in how that goes.
Probably will go the same as food tax?

I don't see why this is interesting. You pay taxes when you buy tomatoes, yet you can always grow them at home. I doubt the state is concerned with rogue tomato growers like Skeletor.
 
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Shadow13
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104 - 07-02-2008, 02:52
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Probably will go the same as food tax?

I don't see why this is interesting. You pay taxes when you buy tomatoes, yet you can always grow them at home. I doubt the state is concerned with rogue tomato growers like Skeletor.

not to mention growing a tomato is a whole hell of a lot easier. Growing weed you have to maintain humidity, temp levels, Co2 levels, your nutrients and soil/hydro.

people think because its called a "weed" that it grows like weed in the grass and it does... but thats if you want to pull an 1/8th every 4 months and not have **** to show for it but a huge ass power bill and added risk to your daily life.
 
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noobfactorNF
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105 - 07-02-2008, 02:56
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Growing is pretty easy, only thing you have to interfere with is Water/Nutes.

Its very easy, yah you have to do some things, no where near as hard as making other drugs.
 
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Oddiz
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106 - 07-02-2008, 03:08
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So lets say they legalize it. What stops the govt. from taking away their federal-aid highway funds like they threatened to do with the minimum drinking age? And could marijuana taxation offset this or just break even?(edit: no, no it would not. according to U.S. Department of Transportation Federal Highway Administration cali will receive an est. $3,072,609,148 for 2008)

They lobby against legalization is just too powerful, organized, and rich imo. You've got potheads going up against big tobacco, the alcohol industy, and probably even pharmaceuticals.

I also wonder if people that would vote no are as or even more motivated to actually go vote than those who would vote yes.
 
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Last edited by Oddiz; 07-02-2008 at 03:16..
Shadow13
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Growing is pretty easy, only thing you have to interfere with is Water/Nutes.

Its very easy, yah you have to do some things, no where near as hard as making other drugs.
Again, if you want "ok" weed sure is. If you want the stuff that you will be able to buy in stores (or now at medicinal shops) its not. You have odor control to worry about (Carbon scrubber works), lighting (cheap route is CFL), you need nutrients, you gotta change the water in hyrdo every week or you run the risk of root rot.

you gotta make sure your res doesnt go above 80 degrees or you can also get rot, or just pretty much put stress on the plant that ruins its potency and yield.

You can't have humidity over 40%, low humidity is also bad for the plant during certain growth stages. You have to power it all, and pay for that power. Then you need the space. Have animals or kids? They get into the res they die. Simple as that. Friends dog drank out of his res and was dead with in 24 hours (using organic nutes)

If you don't have femanized seeds, or a clone from a mother you have to check for male, and if its male pull it before it pollinates all your other plants and gives you hermie's. If you have a mother plant you have to run lighting for at LEAST 18 hours a day to keep her in veg state.

So, I would like to know how its easier to do all this plus as I said above, still be an illegal grower in the eyes of the feds, have to pay power bill plus cost of start up. Do you go on vacation a lot? Sure you can buy an 8 dollar timer, but what about your res?

I just don't think you guys understand that its not as easy as it sounds to just grow premo ganja when if this passes you can walk down the street to a local bar and grab an 1/8th with a 5 dollar tax everytime.
 
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Last edited by Shadow13; 07-02-2008 at 03:12..
Shadow13
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108 - 07-02-2008, 03:11
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So lets say they legalize it. What stops the govt. from taking away their federal-aid highway funds like they threatened to do with the minimum drinking age?

They lobby against legalization is just too powerful, organized, and rich imo. You've got potheads going up against big tobacco, the alcohol industy, and probably even pharmaceuticals.

I also wonder if people that would vote no are as or even more motivated to actually go vote than those who would vote yes.
the same questions they asked when prop 215 was on the ballot. It passed.

Although I do this this is a bit different because its legalizing for people over the age of 21, and not just for the sick and hurting. I will be surprised if it passes just because of the history and hatred for the plant itself has. I mean those black jazz singers give you a joint and all the sudden you turn into a crazy sex starved lunatic! (which was the first reason given when they outlawed it)
 
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noobfactorNF
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109 - 07-02-2008, 03:13
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Getting the plant from Veg to flower is very simple, any moron could do it. Maintaining optimum levels for a Flowering plant can be difficult, but then again, Marijuana has been growing for millions of years possibly and is quite capable of producing great buds without human interference.

If you dont believe that, go checkout Rollitup.org and find FDD2BLK, He has an outside grow where he has 10ft+ plants in 5 gallon buckets and massive nugs, He is re-writing the common theory upon human interference and marijuana cultivation.
 
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Shadow13
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110 - 07-02-2008, 03:15
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Originally Posted by noobfactorNF View Post
Getting the plant from Veg to flower is very simple, any moron could do it. Maintaining optimum levels for a Flowering plant can be difficult, but then again, Marijuana has been growing for millions of years possibly and is quite capable of producing great buds without human interference.

If you dont believe that, go checkout Rollitup.org and find FDD2BLK, He has an outside grow where he has 10ft+ plants in 5 gallon buckets and massive nugs, He is re-writing the common theory upon human interference and marijuana cultivation.

Again, if you want "ok" weed you are right as I have said three times now. If you want the grade of MJ available today in most shops or that will be available if this passes its not true. As a grower of 5 years before I left Cali, Im not just blowing smoke out my ass.
 
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Travace
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111 - 07-02-2008, 03:27
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ahhhh hims gettin upset because he was talkin out his ass and got called on it =( Poor Travace. Next time before opening the pie hole and telling someone else they are wrong, do some checking. K? thanks. and I also voted on it, which is why I knew the year it was.
yea cause i only admitted i was wrong ..that's reallyupset .. here is a tip for you..dont ever play poker because you are horrible at reading people. you seem more upset that i was wrong then i do. your first post is very angry and when i replyed saying i was wrong you even made another angry post

CALM DOWN its just the intertubes
 
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Last edited by Travace; 07-02-2008 at 03:31..
Dumpy Dooby
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112 - 07-02-2008, 03:29
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we already did a vote like this. we voted on a prop to make weed legal for medical uses.. it passed and the feds came in and said **** off but NO!!!

and sorry but 12 years is wrong that prop was not that long ago
Proposition 215, also known as the Compassionate Use Act of 1996, was a proposition in the state of California on the November 5, 1996 ballot. It passed with 5,382,915 (55.6%) votes in favor and 4,301,960 (44.4%) against.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Califor...ion_215_(1996)


 
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Last edited by Dumpy Dooby; 07-02-2008 at 03:39..
Travace
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113 - 07-02-2008, 03:33
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yea yea already mentioned in the thread and i admited i was wrong but if oyu want to get nit picky i technically am not wrong as its not 12 years its 11 and 4 months

SO SUCK IT *****ES
 
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Dumpy Dooby
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114 - 07-02-2008, 03:38
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I wonder how exactly they would plan on getting tax revenue from something you can grow on your property. I would just assume drug dealing would go on as usual as a cash business and only the medical sale would be somewhat consistent to tax.
You can make alcohol in your bathtub, but people don't do that anymore, now do they? You can also grow your own tobacco, but people don't really do that, now do they (though I suppose that's a little bit different)?


It wouldn't make sense to illegally mass distribute it if it's legal. It becomes too big of a risk for the major suppliers. Since those guys are generally well off, they'll just build legal businesses in the same industry. So they'll build hookah bars that have marijuana or something. Now the major suppliers are no longer supplying the dealers, and so the focus for law enforcement turns to small time dealers and growers, which are a lot easier to catch.

Remember: We're not cutting back on law enforcement. The cops that are currently going after big guys will be able to shift their focus, and the State would have a vested interest in stopping the illegal supply. That's not to mention that the State would also have a pretty substantial revenue stream that could help fund the regulation of the industry ... just like with alcohol.
 
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Dumpy Dooby
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115 - 07-02-2008, 03:43
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Eh well you don't really go out and just "Find" seeds right? You can't just go outside and find a female wild growing plant and pick clones..

so you would tax on sale.

seed packages can be per seed.

You could still get clones from friends, but the point is that there is a **** ton of people who would buy through the system and pay their tax just the same as there is some people who brew their own beer, yet the majority of beer drinkers buy it in a store..

because its "easier"
I don't think it's going to be like this at all. They're saying they want it to be akin to alcohol and tobacco, whereby suppliers are licensed. You would need a license to sell it, so I don't think their goal would be to let just any ol' joe grow it since he can just keep cloning and growing more.

They're not looking to be "nice" with this legislation. They're looking to make money. The most efficient way to make money is to charge per usage, which is what I suspect they're going to do. But perhaps I should just look through what's being proposed. ;o
 
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Shadow13
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116 - 07-02-2008, 03:44
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yea cause i only admitted i was wrong ..that's reallyupset .. here is a tip for you..dont ever play poker because you are horrible at reading people. you seem more upset that i was wrong then i do. your first post is very angry and when i replyed saying i was wrong you even made another angry post

CALM DOWN its just the intertubes
yea im frothing at the mouth... im sooooo mad!#% RAR1#@%

give me a break. I just don't like people who talk out their ass and try to pass it off as fact.. Grats on admitting you were wrong though after the fact.
 
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Travace
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117 - 07-02-2008, 03:47
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yea im frothing at the mouth... im sooooo mad!#% RAR1#@%

give me a break. I just don't like people who talk out their ass and try to pass it off as fact.. Grats on admitting you were wrong though after the fact.

OHH NO HE DOES NOT LIKE ME WHAT SHALL I EVER DO!!!!

i never said my word is gold and i never gave a time like i am some know it all. holy **** you are retarded i said it wasnt that long ago and technically it was not.

like i said CALM DOWN (and i dont mean physically at your desk) its jsut the ****ing Internet

edit: anyhow have a good night im sure you will get all mad but try to have a good night Shadow <3 ya
 
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Last edited by Travace; 07-02-2008 at 03:52..
eggo
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118 - 07-02-2008, 04:07
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i dont smoke but i'll vote yes
 
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krustyy
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119 - 07-02-2008, 04:20
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yea yea already mentioned in the thread and i admited i was wrong but if oyu want to get nit picky i technically am not wrong as its not 12 years its 11 and 4 months

SO SUCK IT *****ES
Your incorrect memory seems to also match mine. If this was all passed in '96, it would mean I was still in high school at the time. reading a bit further down in the Wikipedia article reveals this little tidbit:

Quote:
...However, conservative areas such as San Bernardino and Riverside counties saw little change when local officials declared the law null and void due to conflicts with Federal Law, and continued to arrest, prosecute, and in some cases convict legal patients.
In 2003, a compromise between patients***8217; advocates and law enforcement resulted in the passage of Senate Bill 420 by the California Legislature to address vague provisions of Proposition 215.
Travace (and I) are thinking about Senate Bill 420. Before this bill was passed, medical marijuana was still illegal in the eyes of many counties in CA, primarily due to how vague the law was.

So basically, Travace was right. The law was messed up from 96-03. In 03, some changes were made (from a bill even labeled as 420), which made the law much more universally accepted in California.

edit: reading further into SB420, that specific bill also provided the following:
the ability to create dispensaries and co-op growers
an ID card system
protection from being arrested by state authorities

This means that, before SB420 (from 96 to 03)
There were no dispensaries
There were no medical mj ID cards
local authorities were still allowed to arrest and prosecute you under federal laws

So people were forced to grow their own weed (or buy it illegally) even though they had a medical mj prescription. Then, even if they had a prescription, they would still run the chance of being arrested, charged, and convicted by local authorities.

So basically, Travace was right. The compassionate caregiver act was only half of the law that started the ball rolling. The other, much more important half, wasn't around until the start of 2004.
 
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Last edited by krustyy; 07-02-2008 at 04:29..
Dumpy Dooby
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120 - 07-02-2008, 04:56
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So basically, Travace was right.
I said, "It's been 12 years since they legalized medical use of pot."

If you're suggesting that you're right for disagreeing with that statement, then you're wrong. That is, unless your disagreement is to say that it's actually been 11 years and some change ... in which case you'd be right.

But yes, California most definitely legalized the medical use of pot in 1996. Plain and simple.
 
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