[MAP PACK] Released At Last
- Thread starter Geiss
- Start date
Cinderkarst
Veteran X
Homerpf said:
Optimizing a map for comp is one thing. Changing the way the actual game is played is another. In T2, it took scripting and effort to change variables such as generator health or how people spawn. This prevented game-changing decisions from being made arbitrarily. Just because it's now just a variable in a drop-down box doesn't make any less of a sea change.
Doubt thats going to happen, too many "mappers" have gotten their feelings hurt and would rather not budge on their decisions. Not even sure if they actually play T:V much if at all.
I'm going to do my best to have the light spawn played in comp, you guys can play medium spawn on BEML for all I care. It's gotten to the point that there is no point discussing things with some players as they made their mind up from the start.
I'm going to do my best to have the light spawn played in comp, you guys can play medium spawn on BEML for all I care. It's gotten to the point that there is no point discussing things with some players as they made their mind up from the start.
p.s. and just so no one comes in and says you don't have anything against spawning in light but you don't want it to be done in a map pack; that has already been said and repeating it does nothing. For the time being I said to try the maps out and see how they play in spawn. Unfortunately for many (cinde included) they don't really want to do that. Instead they are going to create another pack of the same maps making things even more difficult.
Cinderkarst
Veteran X
mentasm said:
Who's preventing anyone from trying? I encourage it. I simply don't agree with making a big decision like this without consulting the community at large, or at very least the other people involved in the pack's creation. This is a project for the community's benefit, not an attempt to change the nature of the gameplay.
i'm not going to bother reading all of this but im getting the drift.
the way i see it, a map places someone in a senerio. each senerio, be it ctf, fuel, or rabbit gives the player variables to play with, such as invos, turrents, delpaoyables, weapon strength, speed, etc.
A mutator/mod, on the other hand, changes the properties of the variables, not the senerio. This map pack gives us a different senerio in the map, we spawn in light instead of medium.
In a nutshell, we're placed in a different senerio. The variables were not changed. Attack the senerio a different way and create different strategies, but honestly, it's not a big deal
the way i see it, a map places someone in a senerio. each senerio, be it ctf, fuel, or rabbit gives the player variables to play with, such as invos, turrents, delpaoyables, weapon strength, speed, etc.
A mutator/mod, on the other hand, changes the properties of the variables, not the senerio. This map pack gives us a different senerio in the map, we spawn in light instead of medium.
In a nutshell, we're placed in a different senerio. The variables were not changed. Attack the senerio a different way and create different strategies, but honestly, it's not a big deal
Map pack has been in production for a few months now. Never one single mention of changing spawns to light. Why on earth you decided that is beyond me.
What is easier?
Changing 30 maps and re-releasing a 240mb map pack.
or
Enable/Disabling a Mutator on a server?
Hmmmm.
I'm absolutely dumbfounded someone thought this was the right approach to "testing" a gameplay change. A little bit disgusted to.
What is easier?
Changing 30 maps and re-releasing a 240mb map pack.
or
Enable/Disabling a Mutator on a server?
Hmmmm.
I'm absolutely dumbfounded someone thought this was the right approach to "testing" a gameplay change. A little bit disgusted to.
Aesop-The evil one
Veteran X
From now on, all hangings will be with new rope.
Cinderkarst
Veteran X
Homerpf said:
I like spawning in light, but the game is designed so players spawn in medium more often than not. If you want to spawn in light, make a mutator or a pack that clearly defines itself as only light-spawn maps. As an analogy, I bet you'd be pretty pissed if the (x2) pack of T2 suddenly had Renegades elements added in to each map at the .mis level "because it makes it play better". This is a collection of maps for the community, fixed up and bugs with their initial implementations addressed so they are more palatable to competition (as well as pubs). Geiss made things more difficult in doing this, but I don't begrudge him for it. But I will do something about it if I'm not satisfied with the "hows and whys" I'm provided.
Splintering the community is the last thing I want to do, but it's now unavoidable and the damage already done.
KillerONE said:
Truthfully I agree with the mutator thing, however what people don't understand is that we already have a 240 MB map pack that has light spawns. Until the next version is released people should try the map and see how it plays.
No one has said it won't be changed, yet most of you are thinking that. People like Devo_N are mad that one thing was changed about his map and he can't do jack shit about it.
Son of a bitch, some of you folks need to calm down.
I appreciate all the efforts and time that went into making these maps, they really are quality offerings... Thanks.
Though, I don't think we need to pepper T:V with all sorts of different map packs because a few noses got tweaked.
This situation can be resolved in a short time and still keep the mappack intact.
I would ponder that Geiss probably had the good intentions of making the best effort to this mappack, to give it the best chance possible for satisfying the demands of the small community. Though unfortunately, it has not been to well received by some. Everyone involved spent considerable time to refine and package the results. These maps are gems, already the game feels better because of the various mappers works and skills. Now its time to cool down for a moment.
Historically, it has been the mods that have provided the changes to the various armors and weapons. The actual game dynamics and physics that one knows and becomes familiar with.
The maps have provided the the fair gaming field and environment. Structure placements that one uses in a balanced game. The maps are the common denominator, they are the fair and hopefully balanced groundwork that the mods lay upon. One well made map should provide that same battleground that can be played upon by the majority of the mods available. A map is the constant, represented by the environment and the elements defined in an expected manor.
Though the light armor spawning does not bother me, it does change the gameplay with an unexpected dynamic.
I still think the mappack is headed in the right direction, instead of tearing at it, and harbouring ill will towards another, one whom took the responsibility to help. Maybe just reason it out and make the pack work.
Once again, You folks that had anything to do with the mappack deserve a nice thanks from all of us who have done nothing but receive the fruits of your labors.
Thanks.
I appreciate all the efforts and time that went into making these maps, they really are quality offerings... Thanks.
Though, I don't think we need to pepper T:V with all sorts of different map packs because a few noses got tweaked.
This situation can be resolved in a short time and still keep the mappack intact.
I would ponder that Geiss probably had the good intentions of making the best effort to this mappack, to give it the best chance possible for satisfying the demands of the small community. Though unfortunately, it has not been to well received by some. Everyone involved spent considerable time to refine and package the results. These maps are gems, already the game feels better because of the various mappers works and skills. Now its time to cool down for a moment.
Historically, it has been the mods that have provided the changes to the various armors and weapons. The actual game dynamics and physics that one knows and becomes familiar with.
The maps have provided the the fair gaming field and environment. Structure placements that one uses in a balanced game. The maps are the common denominator, they are the fair and hopefully balanced groundwork that the mods lay upon. One well made map should provide that same battleground that can be played upon by the majority of the mods available. A map is the constant, represented by the environment and the elements defined in an expected manor.
Though the light armor spawning does not bother me, it does change the gameplay with an unexpected dynamic.
I still think the mappack is headed in the right direction, instead of tearing at it, and harbouring ill will towards another, one whom took the responsibility to help. Maybe just reason it out and make the pack work.
Once again, You folks that had anything to do with the mappack deserve a nice thanks from all of us who have done nothing but receive the fruits of your labors.
Thanks.
Last edited:
Cinderkarst
Veteran X
Homerpf said:
You're right, it sucks when you put so many hours into making a map and then someone comes along and changes such an intrinsic element without regard to what it does to the way the map plays. When we playtest our maps, it's with each and every element in balance. Switching each and every spawn to light in a community map pack due to personal (or group) preference doesn't work.
If I can get a guarantee of the change back in the next release, then I'll be more than willing back down on this. Such a dramatic change should be left to a mutator or a mod, period.