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Ender P. Wiggin
VeteranXV
Old
61 - 10-23-2007, 16:34
Rabies, I like using the fire axe just so I can do the air guitar after I kill them.

Best. Taunt. Ever.
 
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|V|
VeteranX
Old
62 - 10-28-2007, 20:05
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electricity View Post
PROTIP: Just ****ing heal me, I'll take over
Bad idea. While you may not be put on fire by the other pyro, you will take a huge amount of damage at that range against it. Better off backpedalling and shotgunning at medium range, than engaging melee. Flame thrower hits easier and does more damage than an axe. Axe is only there if you run out of ammo for some reason.
 
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Infinite
VeteranXV
Old
63 - 10-29-2007, 13:18
as a medic

* always uber-up during setup time with solider. if the solider does the damage next to a resupply cabinet they will not have to reload and you can uber quicker(like 10 secs). helpful for ppl who change classes during the setup and lose that uber-up time.
 
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kesh
VeteranXV
Contributor
Old
64 - 10-29-2007, 13:49
Spy:

* Do not dress up as a medic, thats just ****ing retarded (And I will call you out on it)
* Find a way to take damage before entering the enemy lines. I usually take damage, hide, disguise, cloak in, cloak out and ask for healing. When someone sees you being healed by a medic, its like you already gained the trust of the team.
* If you must disguise as a scout, jump...constantly, it earns some trust
* Sapper / knife should be your 'Q'
* When engaging a sentry/engineer combo, don't go right away for it, try to make it look like you're D'ing for the engineer (poke in and out, make rounds) then **** him up.
* You don't need to be behind a guy to backstab him, on top of him works, as well as to the sides.


Scout:

* Realize you are a ****ing pawn, stop bothering medics. Your job is to get to a CP as fast as possible and hold it until heavy/medics finish off the job.

* Learn the best jumps on maps, they are crucial.


Also, for soldiers, a pop up -> mid air combo is glorious, almost as fulfilling as a MAMD
 
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Eggi
VeteranXV
Old
65 - 10-29-2007, 14:47
Quote:
Originally Posted by K` View Post
Spy:

* Do not dress up as a medic, thats just ****ing retarded (And I will call you out on it)
* Find a way to take damage before entering the enemy lines. I usually take damage, hide, disguise, cloak in, cloak out and ask for healing. When someone sees you being healed by a medic, its like you already gained the trust of the team.
* If you must disguise as a scout, jump...constantly, it earns some trust
* Sapper / knife should be your 'Q'
* When engaging a sentry/engineer combo, don't go right away for it, try to make it look like you're D'ing for the engineer (poke in and out, make rounds) then **** him up.
* You don't need to be behind a guy to backstab him, on top of him works, as well as to the sides.


Scout:

* Realize you are a ****ing pawn, stop bothering medics. Your job is to get to a CP as fast as possible and hold it until heavy/medics finish off the job.

* Learn the best jumps on maps, they are crucial.


Also, for soldiers, a pop up -> mid air combo is glorious, almost as fulfilling as a MAMD
lets see, for spy:
*NEVER disguise yourself as a scout. you move too slow and can't double jump. that is by far the worst disguise a spy can use.
*Medic is a close second.
*There is 0 reason to needlessly take damage before going in. The goal of a spy is to not be seen. Running out trying to get a medic to heal you just increases the chance that someone will realize you are a spy.
*The most important thing for a spy is to not be seen. disguises are really just useful for getting from one cloak to the next. you should not spend any time in the open with a disguise.
*pistol/knife should be your q
*when engaging a sentry/engi, you should run up cloaked to get behind the engi if possible, uncloak, backstab, recloak immediately, then uncloak and place sappers. if you cant get to the engi then you get to have a sapper war with him. and you need to hope noone is near by to help him out. if you cant get to the engi and he's got help defending his sentry then good luck.
*the backstab hitbox was updated in the last patch. but it still has problems. of course, now i will occasionally stab square in the back and it wont register a backstab.
*you can start your backstab motion in front of someone, then move behind them, and if the motion finishes when you are behind them you can get a backstab
*if the medic is moving around too much, go straight for the heavy/soldier he is healing. killing either one will hinder the assault. <--thats more of a situational thing of course, but its better to kill the damage dealer than to miss the backstab on the medic and do nothing.

scout:
um one of the key things a scout does is harass medics, and harass in general. scouts are exceptionally good at getting behind medics and taking them out.
 
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Last edited by Eggi; 10-29-2007 at 20:55..
Gauntlet
VeteranXV
Contributor
Old
66 - 10-29-2007, 15:25
Quote:
Originally Posted by K` View Post
Spy:

* You don't need to be behind a guy to backstab him, on top of him works, as well as to the sides.
I was noticing this yesterday. Mostly on the receiving end of the backstab though. The spy I was battling was constantly getting a backstab even when I was facing him head on. Not to confuse this with the knife death. We would be in close range and the spy was infront of me and he would score a backstab, with the appropriate death icon, and I would go flying forward through him just like a "normal" back stab.

I am also amazed how stupid people are that after a spy backstabs 2 people right infront of them that the do not persue and kill the spy.
 
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Statty
VeteranXV
Old
67 - 10-29-2007, 15:28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gauntlet View Post
I was noticing this yesterday. Mostly on the receiving end of the backstab though. The spy I was battling was constantly getting a backstab even when I was facing him head on. Not to confuse this with the knife death. We would be in close range and the spy was infront of me and he would score a backstab, with the appropriate death icon, and I would go flying forward through him just like a "normal" back stab.

I am also amazed how stupid people are that after a spy backstabs 2 people right infront of them that the do not persue and kill the spy.
stonewall? o.o
 
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MaD_ReBeL
VeteranXV
Old
68 - 10-29-2007, 15:30
I'm sad to say i died to a spy dressed as a medic . in my defense i was down to 11 life and had just killed 2 enemy. I had the intel and was heading back to base. i turn around and there is a medic i scream out "MEDIC" and head towards him .... he knifed me in the face and i 'd.

- SHOOT THE ****ING MEDICS FIRST
- DON'T SNIPE IF YOU CAN'T STAY IN THE TOP 5 POINTS WISE (you're better off as a medic or engineer)
 
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kesh
VeteranXV
Contributor
Old
69 - 10-29-2007, 19:21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eggi View Post
lets see, for spy:
*NEVER disguise yourself as a scout. you move too slow and can't double jump. that is by far the worst disguise a spy can use.
*Medic is a close second.
*There is 0 reason to needlessly take damage before going in. The goal of a spy is to not be seen. Running out trying to get a medic to heal you just increases the chance that someone will realize you are a spy.
*The most important thing for a spy is to not be seen. disguises are really just useful for getting from one cloak to the next. you should not spend any time in the open with a disguise.
*pistol/knife should be your q
*when engaging a sentry/sapper combo, you should run up cloaked to get behind the engi if possible, uncloak, backstab, recloak immediately, then uncloak and place sappers. if you cant get to the engi then you get to have a sapper war with him. and you need to hope noone is near by to help him out. if you cant get to the engi and he's got help defending his sentry then good luck.
*the backstab hitbox was updated in the last patch. but it still has problems. of course, now i will occasionally stab square in the back and it wont register a backstab.
*you can start your backstab motion in front of someone, then move behind them, and if the motion finishes when you are behind them you can get a backstab
*if the medic is moving around too much, go straight for the heavy/soldier he is healing. killing either one will hinder the assault. <--thats more of a situational thing of course, but its better to kill the damage dealer than to miss the backstab on the medic and do nothing.

scout:
um one of the key things a scout does is harass medics, and harass in general. scouts are exceptionally good at getting behind medics and taking them out.

I'm glad you posted your tips on how to play a spy. It shows that spies can be played in multiple ways. I don't prefer your style, it brings about way too much suspicion. Seeing as now, people are familiar with the game and the damage a spy can do, your style brings more attention with how suspicious you look.

Dressing up as a medic is the worst, and i won't budge on that point. No one will notice (unless they follow you) your scout speed not being 100%, i don't know the numbers, but im sure the speed is negligible. you won't have much time in the heat of battle to record every scouts speed and go 'oh hey, he's moving slower than a regular scout, he is a spy', as opposed to a medic thats not healing you, when medics should be healing regardless of if you're injured or not.

the pistol is ****ing useless. I don't know how you argue 'not wanting to be seen' and using the pistol. It's terrible, and the only viable time I could see it being used is during a spy v spy duel.

I also don't agree with your engi/sentry strategy. By the time you do that, you're already alerting whoever is D'ing the engineer, you shouldn't hesitate to throw a sapper on. Given that a soldier/demo is defending the engineer, you don't have time to cloak/uncloak.
Sap -> backstab -> sap (if needed)
or backstab -> sap. Your job as a spy is to take down the sentry, not see how long you can survive.

and i don't know how your scout pointer was supposed to 'refute' mine, but w/e, of course scouts are supposed to harass, they are the fly you can't swat.

*I just re-read my statement about scouts bothering medics. I mean pressing E constantly and making friendly medics move to your position for healing.*
 
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Ghetto Youf
Veteran4
Old
70 - 10-29-2007, 20:05
Quote:
Originally Posted by K` View Post
Dressing up as a medic is the worst, and i won't budge on that point. No one will notice (unless they follow you) your scout speed not being 100%, i don't know the numbers, but im sure the speed is negligible. you won't have much time in the heat of battle to record every scouts speed and go 'oh hey, he's moving slower than a regular scout, he is a spy', as opposed to a medic thats not healing you, when medics should be healing regardless of if you're injured or not.
The scout speed is really noticable. Sure if you're in a big battle and not paying attention, people will notice that you aren't moving fast enough.
 
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Eggi
VeteranXV
Old
71 - 10-29-2007, 20:49
Quote:
Originally Posted by K` View Post
I'm glad you posted your tips on how to play a spy. It shows that spies can be played in multiple ways. I don't prefer your style, it brings about way too much suspicion. Seeing as now, people are familiar with the game and the damage a spy can do, your style brings more attention with how suspicious you look.

Dressing up as a medic is the worst, and i won't budge on that point. No one will notice (unless they follow you) your scout speed not being 100%, i don't know the numbers, but im sure the speed is negligible. you won't have much time in the heat of battle to record every scouts speed and go 'oh hey, he's moving slower than a regular scout, he is a spy', as opposed to a medic thats not healing you, when medics should be healing regardless of if you're injured or not.
well the prob with medic is that you run around with a needle gun. but you see a spy as a medic you dont know right away. you see a spy as a scout you know right away EVERY time. they are significantly slower.
in the heat of battle a medic not healing would stick out like a sore thumb. anyways, point is - you should never use either as a disguise.
sniper/engi/pyro/demo behind the lines; pyro/demo/soldier in front. pyro is prolly the best class because they arent expected to be firing at range.

Quote:
Originally Posted by K` View Post
the pistol is ****ing useless. I don't know how you argue 'not wanting to be seen' and using the pistol. It's terrible, and the only viable time I could see it being used is during a spy v spy duel.
the spy revolver is ****ing badass. u use it after you've been detected and you are trying to run away, but someone is chasing you. if you can cloak and run do so, but any time you cant, you want your pistol out.

of course if you arent detected its not needed

and of course if you are moving in to take out a sentry then by all means have sap/knife as your 'q' weapons. i do that. in general i have the pistol tho.

Quote:
Originally Posted by K` View Post
I also don't agree with your engi/sentry strategy. By the time you do that, you're already alerting whoever is D'ing the engineer, you shouldn't hesitate to throw a sapper on. Given that a soldier/demo is defending the engineer, you don't have time to cloak/uncloak.
Sap -> backstab -> sap (if needed)
or backstab -> sap. Your job as a spy is to take down the sentry, not see how long you can survive.
its harder to backstab an engi after you've alerted him you are there by trying to sap his stuff. much easier to kill engi and place saps before any D can react.
you only recloak/uncloak to avoid the sentry. obviously once you do anything by the engineer any d that is around is alerted to your presence. im just saying you will have a much higher success rate against good engineers taking out their turrets by doing that.



Quote:
*I just re-read my statement about scouts bothering medics. I mean pressing E constantly and making friendly medics move to your position for healing.*
ahh gotcha :P
 
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Last edited by Eggi; 10-29-2007 at 20:54..
CarpeIppon
Veteran++
Old
72 - 10-29-2007, 22:45
There are NO absolute rules when it comes to Spying. Well practically none anyway. Disguises that don't work close up may be perfect at farther distances or in certain situations. You should never ever rely on it. Ever. Rely on your cloak and hiding in nooks and crannies, not disguises. And the spy revolver kicks all kinds of ass.

Disguising as a medic can work. If you are a approaching a big firefight from the enemies side, chances are people will be disengaging from battle looking for heals. Should any of them look behind, see you, and start running toward you calling for medic, chances are they are almost dead and are so focused on staying alive they don't see you are holding the nail gun or have 0% ubercharge. Shoot them right in the face and look for a quick backstab on some of the healthier combatants.

Scout disguise has its place too. The spy is one of the fastest classes. Run up to the initial command points on granary and fire off a few shots to help your scouts with the initial cap. Hopefully, take some damage while you are at it. Disguise as scout and move toward the enemies base. You should encounter the heavy-medic combo moving toward the capture point. Since you are both moving toward each other, chances are you will close the distance so fast, they don't have the time to really gauge your speed. They also expect to see damaged scouts. Get your healing, stab the heavy who probably has just walked past you, then shoot the very surprised medic. (note: the above tactic only works in pubs, as a competent scout will have picked up a healing capsule, not asked for a medic.)

And the gun is great. Sap a turret, shoot it. As long as the engineer isn't within 10 feet of the turret, it will die. Sniper against a corner and you can backstab? Shoot him. Snipers and medics both die in 3 shots at reasonably close range.
 
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Last edited by CarpeIppon; 10-29-2007 at 22:57..
Cuda
The A-maze-ing4
Old
73 - 10-29-2007, 22:54
Medic, scout, and heavy are all horrible things to disguise as. Medic because you're not healing and your uber charge isn't showed when you're in crosshairs. Scout and heavy are too easy to tell from the speed not being right.
 
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PyroTeknik
VeteranXV
Contributor
Old
74 - 10-30-2007, 01:30
Quote:
Originally Posted by DwarfVader View Post
Pyro Tips:

*Your shot gun is as much a friend as your flamethrower.

*Don't get kill crazy, if no one sees you go in and torch everyone, but it's ok to set someone on fire and let them run away. Shoot them a few times with your shot gun while they run from you. They will die soon enough.

*Remember, people stay on fire for quite a while. Don't go head to head with a Soldier, just torch him, shoot him and leave. Run backwards shooting him with your shotty. If he's close then torch him again.

*TORCH EVERYTHING, nothing is more fun than catching spies as a pyro.

And the biggest thing I see pyro's doing wrong:

*Don't try to kill other pyro's with your flamethrower, use your shot gun. They don't catch on fire, and don't really burn. So you don't really end up doing as much damage.
QFT.
I've been going on some neat killing sprees by just running into a bunch of enemies, setting them all on fire and running away while they're all on fire and trying to shoot me/find a medic. If any of your teammates are around they'll have a much easier time killing enemies and usually you can confuse the hell out of an offensive push and take a few people with you before you get shot (and you get all the assists too :o). Setting everyone on fire before you kamikaze into the medic is a pretty huge blow to any offensive.
I think the main thing when fighting several people is to not focus on a single enemy and charge but instead try to tap as many of them as possible before retreating or charging the last one. An amusing side effect of charging into multiple enemies is that you're probably going to get more criticals, which usually means that just tapping enemies results in massive damage and gruesome death.

Torching everything is also something I don't see as much as I should. A good spy or two can really wreck a pub by stabbing medics and heavies and god knows what else before people start to react. If you just run around torching corners and everyone you see, you're going to make it practically impossible for any spy to do much damage. Besides, it's hilarious when you catch a cloaked spy out of nowhere and he goes "omg hax"
 
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cerebral
VeteranX
Old
75 - 10-30-2007, 02:46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuda View Post
Medic, scout, and heavy are all horrible things to disguise as. Medic because you're not healing and your uber charge isn't showed when you're in crosshairs. Scout and heavy are too easy to tell from the speed not being right.
I'm pretty sure you move at the Heavy rate of speed when you disguise as one.

I've had good luck pretending to be a heavy, for getting medics to waste their ubers, for stabbing the medic, and almost as satisfying, leading medics to their deaths. Also, people don't seem to question a heavy running towards a sentry/dispenser farm as much as say a demoman since heavies are constantly running out of ammo.

The only problem is that you move so slow that it's tough to backstab anyone that isn't standing still.
 
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MaD_ReBeL
VeteranXV
Old
76 - 10-30-2007, 04:52
i friggin hate spies ... ****in cowards. especially the ones who try to snipe me only to lose their head a few times. then they come after me as a spy.

cowards!
 
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DarkSabreTribal
VeteranX
Old
77 - 10-30-2007, 12:28
Quote:
Originally Posted by cerebral View Post
I'm pretty sure you move at the Heavy rate of speed when you disguise as one.

I've had good luck pretending to be a heavy, for getting medics to waste their ubers, for stabbing the medic, and almost as satisfying, leading medics to their deaths. Also, people don't seem to question a heavy running towards a sentry/dispenser farm as much as say a demoman since heavies are constantly running out of ammo.

The only problem is that you move so slow that it's tough to backstab anyone that isn't standing still.
Classes - TF2 Wiki

Scout and Heavy both have noticeable speed differences for disguised spies.
 
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PyroTeknik
VeteranXV
Contributor
Old
78 - 10-30-2007, 13:03
Quote:
Disguises as a slower class accurately alters speed. Spies cannot run faster by disguising however.
Heavy slows you down properly.
So does soldier.
 
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DarkSabreTribal
VeteranX
Old
79 - 10-30-2007, 13:06
oops can't read.
 
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r00fies
VeteranX
Old
80 - 10-30-2007, 15:47
As an Engineer, Alt Fire rotates your buildings. (mentioned?)
 
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