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Bodom
VeteranXX
Old
21 - 03-26-2005, 08:20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zodie
true... the southshore guards are pretty retarded... but i don't know how many times my guildmates and i have landed in southshore and been immediately raped by horde or found the flightmaster dead on arrival.

despite that, i still wouldn't say alliance towns are "infinately better defended."
stroll around your world and look at all the towns defenses.

then take a look at ours.

hell even in Arathi i think you guys are better defended. 2 entrances with guards along the top (not a big deal for 60s to stay away from) but theyre long grooves.

in Hammerfall you have one meagerly defended entrance then plenty of space to move around in, not to mention the fact you can shoot through the ****ing walls at our windrider and people anywhere near it
 
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Bodom
VeteranXX
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22 - 03-26-2005, 08:25
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Searing Gorge? we have a FP at a neutral camp. You have a base up in the mountains.
Desolace? we have whatever the **** its called (which is decently defended but you can easily use water to get by if you so desire) and you have nigels point, another base up behind a mountain pass.

Stonard in SoS vs Nethergarde Keep.
Theramore vs Brackenwall Village

Camp Mojache beats your little outpost in Feralas for sure.
Hinterlands? none.
Do we have anything similar to Chillwind Point? no.
 
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ZenTseTse
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23 - 03-26-2005, 10:46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zodie
true... the southshore guards are pretty retarded... but i don't know how many times my guildmates and i have landed in southshore and been immediately raped by horde or found the flightmaster dead on arrival.

despite that, i still wouldn't say alliance towns are "infinately better defended."
so, you are basing your opinion on this matter on your experienced getting your ass kicked in southshore instead of on tangible level design distinctions? maybe the factor that the HORDE there are good players is worth noting?

first of all, i have played alliance a lot myself. this isnt a "us vs them" thing to me. it's an OBJECTIVE matter of level design (something i take seriously).

if i thought horde had an unfair advantage, i would say that and post on the forums about the matter....

the FPs of the TM vs SS are pretty equal in terms of access, but the guards are NOT positioned as well overall for TM. this isnt even debatable if you look objectively.

i think for the most part, the smaller towns are more even and ive heard a few legit criticisms from alliance folks about other towns... but you have to look broadly at this in terms of clear patterns.

they just didnt take balance issues seriously between horde and alliance. it's severly titlted towards alliance... and with the big honor system in place this is gonna heat up into very, very nasty customer feedback.

if you want to be objective and see the pattern, start by looking at the capitals and just realizing that alliance dont even have back entrances and are much, much better defended at the front gates in the first place (just look at stormwind with an open mind, then compare to orgrimmar)

sure, blizz finally added guards who can detect stealth, but why? cuz a lowbie alliance rogue could easily walk right up to sylvanas...
 
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Last edited by ZenTseTse; 03-26-2005 at 10:51..
Feannag
VeteranXV
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24 - 03-26-2005, 12:08
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I simply put this here because back when I was on Darkspear there were maybe five guards in the town total, usually walking the beat on the main dock/street. Now they are stationed everywhere. In the buildings, in the Inn, by the Flight Master, all over. And there is probably at least 15 or 16 of 'em now. I was just curious if anyone else had noticed this change and when exactly it occured.
 
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LOL Internet
VeteranXV
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25 - 03-26-2005, 14:32
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Rofl, look at Darkshire. About 30 guards in town then another 30 that wander around and chase you for a mile. Then look at Crossroads or Sun Rock.
 
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Feannag
VeteranXV
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26 - 03-26-2005, 22:13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EAChris
Rofl, look at Darkshire. About 30 guards in town then another 30 that wander around and chase you for a mile. Then look at Crossroads or Sun Rock.
I was there, being level 30 I can quest there. There doesn't seem to be more Watchers than usual, though I did see a group of four watchers who were lvl 20 standing on the road b/w Darkshire and Raven Hill.
 
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LOL Internet
VeteranXV
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27 - 03-26-2005, 22:15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feannag
I was there, being level 30 I can quest there. There doesn't seem to be more Watchers than usual, though I did see a group of four watchers who were lvl 20 standing on the road b/w Darkshire and Raven Hill.
Yeah.. they have always been there. There has always been a ridiculous amount of gards in Darkshire and Duskwood.
 
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Feannag
VeteranXV
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28 - 03-27-2005, 01:09
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EAChris
Yeah.. they have always been there. There has always been a ridiculous amount of gards in Darkshire and Duskwood.
No, I don't think so. I spent plenty of time in Duskwood since the days of Stress Test, and I'm pretty sure I would remember such a group and I don't.

I assume they spawn in to deal with Stitches, and badly I would assume based on their level.
 
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LOL Internet
VeteranXV
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29 - 03-27-2005, 01:18
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The ones that chase you way out of town are like LVL 39. And I mean way out of town. And if you've forgotten go back and look, I was just there.
 
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Feannag
VeteranXV
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30 - 03-27-2005, 01:41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EAChris
The ones that chase you way out of town are like LVL 39. And I mean way out of town. And if you've forgotten go back and look, I was just there.
I was talking about the group.

There are always 3 - 4 watchers walking the roads, as well as half a dozen who are in town in addition to the commander and the same camp by the crossroad into STV.

I count passive guards, not spawn in guards.
 
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zodie
VeteranXX
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31 - 03-27-2005, 02:11
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zen, i'm not disputing anything besides your ridiculous statement that alliance towns are "infinately" better guarded than horde ones. the difference might be there but i think you are taking it a bit far when you say something like that. it sounds like... WHINING to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EAChris
Rofl, look at Darkshire. About 30 guards in town then another 30 that wander around and chase you for a mile. Then look at Crossroads or Sun Rock.
gee... the migty nightwatch guards are level 35-40 at max and it's in contested territory. one of the easiest places for horde to gank lowbie alliance is from darkshire roofs. crossroads is in the barrens (horde territory). i can't comment on sun rock.
 
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Last edited by zodie; 03-27-2005 at 02:16..
Dyno
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32 - 03-27-2005, 02:30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tokin
I'd be cool if they made the guards in SS not so useless. (At least as useful as deathguards at Tarren Mill)
You have got to be ****ing kidding.

The Tarren Mill guards are UNDEAD. They can be hit with Exorcism and Holy Wrath. No, they can't be poly'd, but they can be shackled. Plus, alliancehave a pond that they can (and often do) jump into to keep the guards from hitting them. Southshore has nothing like that. We just have to run until the aggro wears off (which has been known to last all the way to the yeti cave).
 
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Dyno
VeteranXV
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33 - 03-27-2005, 02:36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bodom
Desolace? we have whatever the **** its called (which is decently defended but you can easily use water to get by if you so desire) and you have nigels point, another base up behind a mountain pass.
Actually I'm going to have to disagree with that one. Nijel's Point is easily attacked and held. Me and another rogue were able to hold it for well over an hour. The guards and NPCs are very spaced out so there was also little to no matrix spawn.

Plus the guards are level 45, compared to Shadowprey's 55.
 
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Bodom
VeteranXX
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34 - 03-27-2005, 03:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EAChris
The ones that chase you way out of town are like LVL 39. And I mean way out of town. And if you've forgotten go back and look, I was just there.
no there are a good junk of guards in darkshire, then more patrollers

add onto the fact that once a guard sees you he yells for help and more spawn
 
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MaDAssassin
VeteranXX
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35 - 03-27-2005, 14:34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZenTseTse
are you kidding? like bodom said, the balance is (as usual) completely in alliance's favor.

SS guards aggro from like 1000 ft away and cover every corner.

meanwhile, TM guards do not... and you can even camp the damn TM graveyard with little effort.

generally speaking, alliance towns/cities are infinately better defended.

just take stormwind and ironforge, compare the entrances to orgrimmar and undercity (oh, right... horde have BACK entrances as well, with even less guards)
LOL

You've obviously havnt tried raiding TM before...

Hey look we are just outside the town, heylook 50,000 Death Mill Gaurds just spawned...

The ****ing spawn is either broke or just stupid...when you fight in TM on Tichondrius its just a spam of stupid ****ing gaurds... Least SS doesnt spawn a billion gaurds.
 
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Pagy
VeteranXX
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36 - 03-27-2005, 15:05
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once you learn how far you can get into either ss or tm w/o the autospawning guards, it's not really that big of an issue

anyhow we can move to the issue of major cities and how horde ones have 2 ways into each one and how no alliance town does... unless you wantt o count the tram in which case you'd have to get through another city first.

the game is alliance biased
it's not that big of a deal just as long as you accept that blizzard hates the horde, and if you need any proof i beg that you try questing in the barrens
 
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Dyno
VeteranXV
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37 - 03-27-2005, 16:09
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaDAssassin
The ****ing spawn is either broke or just stupid...when you fight in TM on Tichondrius its just a spam of stupid ****ing gaurds... Least SS doesnt spawn a billion gaurds.
Maybe because the horde are smart enough to kill the NPCs that spawn the guards? It's the exact same spawn rate for any town in the game. When an NPC calls for guards, a guard spawns. If 2 people are in their alert radius when they call for guards, 2 guards spawn. And so on.

So it's the exact same spawn rate in both towns. But TM guards are undead, and you have a pond to jump into.
 
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ThisIsNotMyName
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38 - 03-27-2005, 17:42
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I can't wait to understand just what the **** you all are talking about.
 
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Ztir
VeteranXX
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39 - 03-27-2005, 18:08
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeNdeL
I can't wait to understand just what the **** you all are talking about.
You don't want to know


Did anyone metion SSR yet? 2 entrances, and more often then not if you have at least 1 person over 40 you can take the town over and hold it
 
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Feannag
VeteranXV
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40 - 03-27-2005, 21:25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeNdeL
I can't wait to understand just what the **** you all are talking about.
The logistics behind spawning NPC guards and the hypothetical defense of a town versus it's realistic defense. Some complain Horde towns are easier to take, and then alliance players jump in with their own poorly defended towns, and the argument bats back and forth.

It's the product of useless and incentive-devoid PvP.
 
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