Son of a preacher man says it is all a big show meant to draw out emotion and fear. They then use that to draw out money from people with a guilty conscience and this benefits both parties.

1 side gets to feel righteous and sanctimonious and the other side gets cash.

Still haven't seen an example of a happy atheist yet, btw.

Originally Posted by Pagy

so based on this topic, what happened to make you come to a realization that religion isn't for the weak?

Because generally it's far easier to not have a religion.

For someone who has gone most of his life without one, with the freedom to do whatever/whenever while practicing the general philosophy of Do As Thou Wilt, I think putting restrictions on behavior, words, thoughts, actions, and reactions takes infinitely more strength than just doing whatever, whenever.

Saying "no" usually takes far more strength than saying "yes" most of the time, is what I'm saying.

Originally Posted by SuicideTaxi

Feel free to answer my question from earlier.

How did you determine that your religious beliefs shouldn't be on the list of things you are/were wrong about?

Originally Posted by SuicideTaxi

Because generally it's far easier to not have a religion.

For someone who has gone most of his life without one, with the freedom to do whatever/whenever while practicing the general philosophy of Do As Thou Wilt, I think putting restrictions on behavior, words, thoughts, actions, and reactions takes infinitely more strength than just doing whatever, whenever.

Saying "no" usually takes far more strength than saying "yes" most of the time, is what I'm saying.

which religion did you choose and why?

Originally Posted by SuicideTaxi

Because generally it's far easier to not have a religion.

For someone who has gone most of his life without one, with the freedom to do whatever/whenever while practicing the general philosophy of Do As Thou Wilt, I think putting restrictions on behavior, words, thoughts, actions, and reactions takes infinitely more strength than just doing whatever, whenever.

Saying "no" usually takes far more strength than saying "yes" most of the time, is what I'm saying.

if you really break it apart, it gets hairy.

you're ascribing virtue to "rule adherence" and then concluding an atheist (not sure what that means) has less rules to adhere to.

i think it loses weight on moral arguments. take stealing.

for a theist:
god makes a rule against stealing. god promises a reward for adherence. the theist abides by that rule.

for an atheist:
make a moral choice to steal or not.

both would be subject to social contracts, laws, etc so its a wash.

personally, i don't see there being much virtue at all, in obeying a divine ruleset that promises rewards compared to someone that simply makes a moral judgement.

outside of a moral argument, you can argue that a practising muslim requires a lot of discipline to pray / abide by the many rules. having said that, there are many religious people that have no discipline and don't practice at a consistent level. again we're ascribing a lot of virtue to the idea of discipline, but if a muslim that abides by many rules is obese for example...are we again giving him the "strength trophy" for discipline? point being: boiling down someone's "strength" or "weakness" based on religious beliefs or lack thereof seems too myopic.

I didn't choose a religion per se, although I did make a conscious choice to adjust myself to return to a life and personal energy that's more in line with Christian values, teachings, and doctrines.

I guess it really comes down to crutches... can you or can you not go through life and face death with uncertainty or do you feel the need to cover you bases?

Both sides rely on the same amount of evidence to make that choice

Originally Posted by Amadeus

Feel free to answer my question from earlier.

How did you determine that your religious beliefs shouldn't be on the list of things you are/were wrong about?

By having them, then discarding them, and then reacquiring them.

Originally Posted by Pagy

if you really break it apart, it gets hairy.

you're ascribing virtue to "rule adherence" and then concluding an atheist (not sure what that means) has less rules to adhere to.

i think it loses weight on moral arguments. take stealing.

for a theist:
god makes a rule against stealing. god promises a reward for adherence. the theist abides by that rule.

for an atheist:
make a moral choice to steal or not.

both would be subject to social contracts, laws, etc so its a wash.

personally, i don't see there being much virtue at all, in obeying a divine ruleset that promises rewards compared to someone that simply makes a moral judgement.

outside of a moral argument, you can argue that a practising muslim requires a lot of discipline to pray / abide by the many rules. having said that, there are many religious people that have no discipline and don't practice at a consistent level. again we're ascribing a lot of virtue to the idea of discipline, but if a muslim that abides by many rules is obese for example...are we again giving him the "strength trophy" for discipline? point being: boiling down someone's "strength" or "weakness" based on religious beliefs or lack thereof seems too myopic.

I don't recall ever equating morality or virtue with theism or religion.

You've just concocted a whole argument that exists only in your own head.

So how do we prove a happy atheist exists anyway?

Originally Posted by SuicideTaxi

I didn't choose a religion per se, although I did make a conscious choice to adjust myself to return to a life and personal energy that's more in line with Christian values, teachings, and doctrines.

all the power to you.
if more christians acted like christ the world would be a far better place. if you think about intolerant, conservative christians...jesus was the polar opposite. we're talking about a hippy dude that lived in poverty, hung out with every imaginable social reject and preached peace and love and acceptance.

then there's my older sister, the baptist, who told me once she's disown and kick out her son if he was gay. if jesus heard that i think he'd kick her in the box.

I mean isn't it really about you guys trolling other people using eternal life as your high ground?

Neener neener I am going to heaven and you are not cause I believe in god and you dont!

Originally Posted by SuicideTaxi

I don't recall ever equating morality or virtue with theism or religion.

You've just concocted a whole argument that exists only in your own head.

you said strength; i assumed you intended the "strength" attribute to be virtuous.

"See? I went to church and put cash in the plate. God loves me and you are going to hell." (Promptly cuts off car with right of way, as they haul ass out of church parking lot)

Originally Posted by SuperTrap

I guess it really comes down to crutches... can you or can you not go through life and face death with uncertainty or do you feel the need to cover you bases?

Both sides rely on the same amount of evidence to make that choice

That's over-simplifying possibly the biggest question to face human beings, diluting "Why am I here?" into a fairly demeaning box - "do you need a crutch to get through life?"

Hardly.

Well, actually that's probably not true... like most people I maybe could use a crutch or two... except my pride won't allow it and I wind up throwing them to the side. I guess I'd rather hop awkwardly than use a crutch... at least then I'm still under my own power.

having your beliefs trashed hurts doughnut?

Originally Posted by SuperTrap

I mean isn't it really about you guys trolling other people using eternal life as your high ground?

Neener neener I am going to heaven and you are not cause I believe in god and you dont!

Can you circle the part in this thread where someone said that?

Don't recall seeing it.

Or... like... is this just some atheistic projection type of deal where you use the conversation to just start slinging around random anti-God/anti-religion phrases? In which case... ok, carry on.

As a survivor of 4 heart attacks and a southern baptist preacher's kid.. and christian schools and doctrine and learning and knowledge of the subject that goes way beyond the common lay person.. I feel confident about death. I am not worried at all and I am happy

The God I learned exists is a cruel, jealous god and if he truly exists then I want no part of him.


Prove me wrong

Hrmph.

You seem angry and bitter.