[Feedback] TV's Sensor System

It really hurts HO, as Candide says. You get enemies all over you before you are even 1/2 way across the map. And it doesn't matter if you use a sneaky route because they have the all seeing super sensor. Very lame.

I can't agree more. We're already seeing overpowered D and this is beta. A year from now, with the radar + turrets + repair turrets + sensor crap, the game will be a nightmare for any O.

Cappers will have a hard time.
It's much too easy to spot good routes with the sensor, and even replicate them afterwards.

HoFs and HD also need to be a lot less aware than they used to.

I'd prefer a LOS based sensor net that always shows people around your base as well (so you'll still see that incoming HO/capper, but not from 3000 miles away).

Could a dev comment on how hard this feature would be to mod in (not necessarily by IG) at a later date if the community wanted it?

Agreed. I do like the sensors in that they're very powerful though, the old (T2-type) sensors were nigh-on worthless since your built-in player radar more then made up for the lack of your sensor. This is a bit much though.

HOWEVER I disagree on the 'concealed ski routes' point. I believe the sensor should cover all open ground within its range. If the sensor is still online, you should be detected, simple as that. I personally find it incredibly hard to see people running around (unless they're jetting) without sensor indicators, and I've noticed other people won't notice me as much either. If terrain blocked sensor, you'd be looking at nearly pathetic sensor coverage on some maps, and fights would involve going in and out of the sensor range. Sniping would be shitass easy since you could just 'hide' behind terrain and be invisible. Sensors are a powerful tool, both in Tribes and in real life. I prefer to think that the sensor is a sattelite uplink and the real sensor is high overhead in space.

Limit the sensor range, or at least give it a reduced effect at longer ranges (so IFF only shows up within a small range around your player). But I disagree, terrain shouldn't block sensor. That would make sensor almost worthless again.

Deployable sensors got some use on high fog maps, as seeing the big red IFF gave you alot of time to react before a capper came in. So it wasnt all about the main sensor. On some maps it was fairly important to take down the main sensor, or you wouldnt get by many compatent LD.

I made a thread like this a while back and still feel like the sensor system has been "dumbed-down" and taken away alot of skills that were used in the previous tribes games.

examples might be
T1: Obsfucation (hey gimmie a break, this was a few years ago)
T2: Quagmire

On both of these maps deployable sensor helped d alot in stopping cappers. As it is now, all the D has to do is repair whore the main sensor on any given map :(

I too thought the sensor would be a LOS type of deal, and i like that idea better (LOS for sensor and players/turrets).

My opinion when they announced the new sensor system was that it would detract from strategy, the need for awareness, and dumb down the game in general. My opinion after playing is that it is even worse. This is REALLY compounded by the relative ease of repairing a base and keeping the sensor functional.

Limit the sensor range, or at least give it a reduced effect at longer ranges (so IFF only shows up within a small range around your player). But I disagree, terrain shouldn't block sensor. That would make sensor almost worthless again.

Sup Uranium. I believe we bumped into each other while skiing the other day :D

I think the sensor is a good addition. Limiting the range so that you can't see everything is a reasonable compromise.

Hahaahahah :D Yes, yes we did. As for the sensor, look at Isle - the sensor on that has a blindspot completely on the left side of the base (From Imp base at least... I think the BE base is ugly as sin and don't really like playing it), the base itself would block LOS for areas around it, and you'd only get sensor coverage on a couple hills and in the big 'ruts' that radiate out from it. The sensor would be nearly worthless.

LOS limitations would work if, as mentioned, we had deployable sensor packs. We don't. So LOS sensor probably won't be a workable solution.

My .02 cents on sensor.

Personally I do not like that fact that you can see the entire map and what every player is doing. Limited ranged sensors was/has been part of the strategy from the begnning and adds another level of tactics to the game. Planning for offensive runs and placing things in "relatively hidden" parts of the map i.g. remote inventory stations were always key to match play. The only downside to this is there are no deployable sensors to offset the destruction of the main base radar.

If the limited range radar gets attention from the devs, then maybe depoylable turrets/whatever could have a secondary passive function of its own radar "bubble"...only smaller than the main base range.

And I don't like the in game happyflag - I like relying on teammates and vice versa for capper locations and actually having to find the capper. This may speed up gameplay on returns, but I think potentially it could promote more turtling, when hiding used to be a viable option.

Right now I don't think many players realize how powerful the sensor is. Last night was the first time I sat down and played some LD with full attention to the map. I found that it's way too easy to defend with the current "happyflag" sensor system. There is no skill required in predicting cappers. All I had to do was make sure I timed my spam on the flag and almost no one could get through. I'm definitely not the best LD out there either. And this was mostly just me and another guy on the flag.

It doesn't help that the sensor is also very difficult to destroy. With a heavy it takes a ton of grenade and mortar spam to take them down, and only takes about 6 seconds to repair it back up again. I guess it adds another objective to the game, but I'd hate to be the HO who is assigned sensor attack duty.

Perhaps base sensors should be taken out completely? If they are made to be realistic and balanced to allow actual team strategy, then a base sensor just becomes a hood ornament to the roof of your base. As we see now, if a base sensor provides an infinite range of site and is nearing on invincible, the game suffers even more. If everyone acted as a LOS sensor, then you would just have to kill the enemies to get rid of them spying on you -isn't this what the new game is about, simplification?

:nag: Feature Complete :nag:
we may be stuck with the existing model, even if it sucks.

Yeah the sensor is too much of a cruch/dominating feature depending if its up/down. Yeah you can knock it out and probably keep it knocked out but thats not CTF. Its blow up/repair the radar dome which sounds about as much fun as fighting a bomber and 2 fighers coordinating defense on winterlake. Just doesnt seem like tribes CTF....

Players acting as sensors would be much better gameplay IMO. Having the current system makes the rover pretty useless, cappers doing nice routes (or even hiding behind a hill nearby) since the LD know when and where they are coming from. Theres just no suprise/shock factor to anything because you see it all developing on the map/radar.

I can understand your concerns, but I would like to see the sensors role in coordinated team matches before I judge it. pubs are a different matter...

Agreed. I know where people are coming from, but it's relatively difficult to predict how things are going to play out as players and tactics progress. It may seem like D has some advantages, but considering how easily the flag can be capped once someone has it, makes me think D may need these features. Of course it may end up that I am entirely wrong, but the way it's currently set up is a proactive rather than reactive type of system. Meaning D has a better ability at preventing O at grabbing their flag, but that (I believe) is balanced against the fact that once a capper has the flag, it's nearly impossible to stop them.

I'd like to see how things progress and how difficult it is to take out the sensor etc in matches, before I start asking for changes. Though feedback is good and concerns are warranted.

the sensor now precludes the need for cameras (one of my favorite things in tribes 2) or any other type of surveilance. i liked sneaking into an enemy base (no cloak pack either) planting cameras and a satchel charge, then watching the cameras till some unsuspecting group of people walked by. i also liked being able to place a camera on katabatic on the towers overlooking the vpad and scoping out the enemy d. now, all i have to do is hit c before i go in and viola! theres an instant map of everything i need to know. make the sensor limited range but still all seeing and have the players act as mini sensors. so for 100m around the sensor i can see anyone and anyone within LOS of a player.

It would be nice to see more maps w/o sensors period. It's easy enough to be able to differenciate teams with the colored jet trails in most cases.

So still no one really in favour of the new system. What about the original beta testers? did this topic ever come up? and if so what was the general concensus, i'd really like to know what you guys have suggested to IG, or are/were you all happy with it as is? These are genuine questions by the way, not attempts to have a dig at anyone....