[Feedback] Observation/Solution to the Jet Pack Issue?

Something occurred to me last night while playing T:V.

"Hey...maybe the overwhelming verticle thrust is a result of having Jump+Jet bound to a single key by default! Maybe they made it so you jet UP more if you hold the jump key down at the same time. If they gave the UP jetting precedence over the forward/left/right/back jetting, that could explain why the lift is so exaggerated."

So I stopped playing (ahem) testing, and brought up the controls screen. I removed the Jump+Jet bind and configured separate keys for jumping and jetting. I was onto something! I could feel it!

I then tried jetting without jumping first. WHOOOOOOOSH! Up up and away like a rocket...it made no difference at all. In fact, it made almost no difference whether I jumped or not; jetting resulted in so much vertical thrust that jumping was irrelevant.

"So much for that theory," I thought. And then I had one of those little "hmmmm" moments.

Hmmmmm.

:look: My proposed solution to the jet pack issue: :look:

1. Make it so that you thrust more in direction of the key you're pressing. Just like people are asking for, make it so that if you press W, you get more forward thrust, and if you press S, you get more rearward thrust.

2. Make it so that if you hold the jump key while you thrust, you get more vertical thrust. And, to preserve the current behaviour which IG seems to believe is friendlier to newbies, make the jump key override any other keys as far as thrusting goes. If you hold the jump key, your thrust vector will be exactly as it is right now.

3. Leave Jump+Jet as the default key bind.

Voila! It works exactly the way it does now for new users...but for those of us who want more horizontal control, they can get it simply by binding separate keys for jumping and jetting.

Jumping in T:V does practially nothing, I don't even understand why they left it in.

But yes, we need a touch more horizontal thrust.

Good idea, but I doubt it will make it in :(

Excellent idea from a great contributor to the Tribes world.

:wave: writer

Thanks for all of your great scripts over the years bro. Hows the writing going? (That questions was spawned from reading your website eons ago)

this is a surprisingly good idea. It should at least be tried

:bump:

Excellent idea from a great contributor to the Tribes world.

:wave: writer

Thanks for all of your great scripts over the years bro.

Thanks Orcus. :)

I like it.

Just like flightsim/racing sim Arcade/Simulation physics modes, but hidden in a seemless way so you dont even know there is an option.

Love it! Choice....

3. Leave Jump+Jet as the default key bind.

uhh, but if you do that. and you jet . you are jumping. wouldnt that make it always have more horizontal thrust. lol. maybe i just didnt get you fully. but i get the idea. explain a little more!?!?

uhh, but if you do that. and you jet . you are jumping. wouldnt that make it always have more horizontal thrust. lol. maybe i just didnt get you fully. but i get the idea. explain a little more!?!?

Anytime you hold 'jump' the jetpack behaves just as it does now. (mostly verticle thrust nomatter what direction key is being held)

Anytime you DONT hold 'jump' the jetpack behaves as in T1, you get horizontal thrust instead of verticle if you hold a directional key.

The trick is that the game has different combinations of ski/jump/jet you can bind. So you can hold 'jump' by having 'jump/jet' bound to RMB instead of just 'jet'.

great idea. i hope the devs listen to either this thread, my thread, or pach's thread. it seems to me that the general consensus wants more lateral movement in the directiony you hold. not as much as t1 for example, but just a little more so we have more control. Even if its only change by a little bit, i would still be greatly please :)

Isn't this supported as a modifiable value in the UT engine as "air control"

air control is different; it is what you get with just the strafe keys

supposedly we get 50% of our thrust vectored now, but it that doensnt seem to be working?

a little aircontrol would be nice now that i think of it....

I then tried jetting without jumping first. WHOOOOOOOSH! Up up and away like a rocket...it made no difference at all. In fact, it made almost no difference whether I jumped or not; jetting resulted in so much vertical thrust that jumping was irrelevant.
There's either a bug or I suspect you've done something wrong. The initial jump impulse, though seemingly small, makes a massive difference in the maximum height you can achieve.


1. Make it so that you thrust more in direction of the key you're pressing. Just like people are asking for, make it so that if you press W, you get more forward thrust, and if you press S, you get more rearward thrust.
This is how it works already, unless I missed something.


2. Make it so that if you hold the jump key while you thrust, you get more vertical thrust. And, to preserve the current behaviour which IG seems to believe is friendlier to newbies, make the jump key override any other keys as far as thrusting goes. If you hold the jump key, your thrust vector will be exactly as it is right now.

But this doesn't preserve the current behaviour. It's not instinctive nor intuitive to press the space bar in order to jet vertically. In fact you could say it's counter-intuitive because people associate the spacebar more with "down" than "up" in T:V.

Maybe I missed what you were trying to say. Could you explain it better?
KP

You mean incorporating two different systems and making the difference be a key to hold down?


I'm not sure I'm bought on this one... :hrm:

There's either a bug or I suspect you've done something wrong. The initial jump impulse, though seemingly small, makes a massive difference in the maximum height you can achieve.

I was wondering about that. Okay, I'll check my user.ini tomorrow night and make sure a secondary key bind didn't get left bind or something.

This is how it works already, unless I missed something.

I meant "more" force as in more than is exhibited now.

But this doesn't preserve the current behaviour. It's not instinctive nor intuitive to press the space bar in order to jet vertically. In fact you could say it's counter-intuitive because people associate the spacebar more with "down" than "up" in T:V. I don't; I still often slap it by instinct to go up. But that's just habit from playing years of T1/T2 and every other FPS under the sun where space == jump.

However, note that I said the jump key, not the space bar. In my universe, jumping up doesn't make you go down (well, what goes up eventually comes down, but you know what I mean). :)

The ideal movement interface for me would be for the jets to simply thrust more in the direction you're moving in (or rather, more in the direction whose key you're pressing).

For example, pressing W would make you run forward. Pressing W + jet key would make you jet forward (with a bit of residual vertical thrust).

Pressing S + Jet would make you jet backwards/decelerate.

Pressing jet alone would make you jet upwards but with less force than it currently does.

Pressing Jump key + Jet key together would make you jet up very hard (like jetting currently does).

This is essentially just like the way it is in T:V now, but with 2 important differences:

1. Jetting with WASD has a more pronounced effect.
2. Jetting alone (without the Jump key) has a less pronounced effect.

Assuming the Jump+Jet (combined) key simulates *holding* the jump key down while jetting, and that the Jump+Jet key is the default key bind, the above model would still behave exactly the same (aside from the increased lateral movement of point #1) as it does now from the perspective of new users.

Maybe I missed what you were trying to say. Could you explain it better?
KPDoes the above make more sense? (I'm rushing because, well, it's 4:32 AM and I still need to sleep before I go to work.)

To be honest, I'm getting more and more used to the way it is right now...although it still feels like I need a bit more lateral thrust at low speeds.

I definitely need to confirm my key binds, though...

i agree with threadstarter

There's either a bug or I suspect you've done something wrong. The initial jump impulse, though seemingly small, makes a massive difference in the maximum height you can achieve.

Maximum height really doesn't matter in most situations as much much as how fast you can acheive a height. Firing off your jets in T:V is nice, but a little too much in comparison to jump-jetting.