Some thoughts of mine...

For the hell of it, I'm posting some stuff I feel is supoptimal with T:V's design. I'll remain optimistic in tone, but these are the design decisions I personally disagree with, though I can see why they might be justified:

Lack of Repair Kits:

I love the repair kit. It's a tiny dose of health in the field.

In T:V, there are no repair kit (as of this moment). Instead, (compared to T1 and T2) the health that would be restored by the kit is already added onto the end of your full health bar.

The justifications in the current design are many and easy to create:


The repair kit competes with the repair deployable and repair pack. It's a redundant item.
The repair kit is an excess keybind that can be removed.
The repair kit causes feedback loops that can be considered bad. Newbies get slaughtered (never having used their kits), or newly spawned people in bases get insta-killed by HO mortars and their bodies are harvested for kits. In certain situations, this can artificially inflate the life of the offensive player. Since some T:V changes have "weakened" defense, the offense can be partially counterbalanced by removing the possiblity of these feedback loops.
The repair kit is redundant. After all, the health COULD just be on your health bar. Why should it be on a keybind that you might forget to press?


The reasons for it's inclusion are as follows:


The repair kit can be considered supplementary to other repair methods. In the old games, even though it was a small effect, you could toss repair kits to HoFs or other defensive players, including the flag carrier. This was a cheap repair trick that didn't need any of the other items.
The repair kit's feedback loops are needed to make the offense better. Plus, in gametypes like Arena, they award people for kills that were instant or near-instant, by giving them a spot of health to harvest.
It was in T1 and T2, and people are familiar with the concept and enjoy it.


These problems can yet be answered case by case in T:V's design:


The repair kit is still redundant to the other repair methods. After all, the new repair pack and repair deployable are far more efficient ways of repairing players.
The feedback loops can be bad, if it's newbie versus vet. The newbie feels terrible because he doesn't know why the other player keeps regenerating health, while he gets killed easily. It's frustrating. This conclusion is backed by focus group testing. The repair kit is not friendly.
T:V is not T1 or T2.


I maintain it should be included because I believe tossing it to other players who need the health is a VERY important trick. Nevertheless, it is a MINOR trick, and ultimately, it can be argued the repair kit is redundant.

I want the repair kit back anways. It was a part of vintage Tribes, and especially important to arena gameplay, where picking them up off spawn areas and dead players could help you AND encourage offensive play.

The packs can't be activated temporarily. Currently, activating a pack fully drains the pack charge:

This one I'm torn about. On one hand, it's obviously a loss of skill when you can't control your pack's discharge. On the other hand, it makes packs more powerful when you can control your pack's discharge. The packs are already super powerful, so the change could make them too powerful.

Example:

The new shield pack (currently) lasts for 5 seconds, recharges in about 8 seconds.

Wearing the shield pack protects you from about one quarter of the damage you would normally take. The active effect protects you from about three quarters of the damage you would normally take.

Now, one the one hand, this pack is FAR more powerful than the T1 and T2 packs. This is because you can still jump-jet while taking only a QUARTER damage from weapons. That's insane protection.

Yet, it's for five seconds, and then you have to wait for it to reload. It seems balanced, because this super protection then drops down to mediocre protection for a period of time. There is skill in activating the ability when you need it most. Then you must weather the storm until the pack is ready again.

On the other hand though, if you can turn the activation ability on and off, then you can use the protection only when you need it most. It adds skill to pack management.

But there might a real problem. A skilled player can EASILY activate the charge in short bursts, rejecting the damage from discs and mortars, then instantly turning off the pack to save charge.

If you were attempting to shoot at such a player, burning through his shield pack energy would be simply impossible without an incredible hailstorm of firepower. This is especially true because HE CAN STILL JUMP JET.

When you allow a person to turn the packs on and off, the packs become very powerful. Therefore, while I want them to give us the ability to turn the packs on and off rather than blow the pack charge, I also recognize that this would make the packs super-ultra-powerful.

So in the end, the new change is for the better, even if it is - sadly - simplified. :/ I wonder if cutting back the charge quantity might make the toggleable packs viable. Hrmm...

Oh yes, and I apologize at the wandering, unorganized structure of ny thoughts, or possibly even the bad writing. I haven't actually read them; I merely wrote them.

after you kill somebody wont they drop health or something?

One thing I wonder about the new repair deployable thingies, do they heal enemies too?

I do not think the removal of the repair kit is bad at all. The newbie reasons for leaving it out are OK I guess but overall not that strong in my view. The reason I see for taking it out is to give a little bit more advantage to the defending team. If an attacking player is able to keep repairing themselves well attackking(i think you said this in your long post zooloo) then that doesn't seem right. The player closer to their base should have more of an advantage in terms of heatlh, so an offensive person should be at a disadvantage at this point. I can't think of a way to end this.

Only in single player. I hope not in MP (except maybe in Arena, but that's another long post.) Ugh, that'd be horribly bizzare.

Edit: I was replying to KnightMare.

To reply to Jodo: I'd imagine not, since the repair pack doesn't.

It happens in single-player.

Repair kit is a waste of time.

And how about shield-pack rotation? HoF comes under fire. He activates his pack, and throws it away. Someone throws a fresh shield pack to him. He activates, throws it away.

Repeat.

Packs picked up off the ground are already discharged. He'd have to wait for it to recharge. No chaining of pack charges.

One thing I wonder about the new repair deployable thingies, do they heal enemies too?

I do not think the removal of the repair kit is bad at all. The newbie reasons for leaving it out are OK I guess but overall not that strong in my view. The reason I see for taking it out is to give a little bit more advantage to the defending team. If an attacking player is able to keep repairing themselves well attackking(i think you said this in your long post zooloo) then that doesn't seem right. The player closer to their base should have more of an advantage in terms of heatlh, so an offensive person should be at a disadvantage at this point. I can't think of a way to end this.

I'm torn here. Being a mainly defensive player in Tribes, I don't want the advantage. If keeping health kits in will give offenses an advantage, then I'm all for their inclusion.

I'm all for their inclusion because they were cool, because it gave me the illusion of control over my character's health, and because it was awesome to give a flag carrier your repair kit when the base was down.

Packs picked up off the ground are already discharged. He'd have to wait for it to recharge. No chaining of pack charges.

I'm saying, player A is Hof, player B is HoF-assistant.

B charges a pack and throws it to A.

Is it discharged as soon as it leaves B's backside?

I assume, yes.

Edit: If you want to help the HoF, use a repair pack.

What are you basing your assumption off of? Something a dev said?

Also, the repair pack may too slow to fend off speed-mortar spam.

Only in single player. I hope not in MP (except maybe in Arena, but that's another long post.) Ugh, that'd be horribly bizzare.

Edit: I was replying to KnightMare.



then removing the rk is just stupid :/

The repair pack and the HoF's shield pack reducing the damage should do you lots of good. After all, the HoF can jump jet while the shield pack works.

then removing the rk is just stupid :/

I wouldn't call it stupid, just an unnecessary removal. It's inclusion - or lack of inclusion - isn't that big of a deal, so I was saddened when it was removed. Nevertheless, one can argue that it shouldn't be included exactly because it allowed you to scavenge the health from dead defenders.

Plus there are the newbies who get raped because their health was part of a kit, rather than part of the health bar.

one can argue that it shouldn't be included exactly because it allowed you to scavenge the health from dead defenders.

if anything I think this should be one the main reasons to keep it.When my base is raped/camped, killing a LO before he got to use his kit helps alot to keep your loadout.If im in the red I cant DJ to chase the capper.

I posted a response to this in GD:


The repair kit competes with the repair deployable and repair pack. It's a redundant item.
You don't always carry those around with you and spawn with them.


The repair kit causes feedback loops that can be considered bad. Newly spawned people get insta-killed by HO mortars and their bodies are harvested for kits. In certain situations, this can artificially inflate the life of the offensive player. Since some T:V changes have "weakened" defense, the offense can be partially counterbalanced by removing the possiblity of these feedback loops.
It has been suggested that the repair kit should be auto-activated when you drop below its max repair amount. This way, newbs won't be at a major disadvantage, while vets can micromanage the kit if they want. They could even have it unbound by default if they are desperate to clean up the keyboard.


The repair kit is redundant. After all, the health COULD just be on your health bar. Why should it be on a keybind that you might forget to press?
Timing when you choose to use a repair kit adds to the game. I often use the kit even if I haven't dropped below its max repair amount if I'm about to go into a dangerous situation. It's all about timing, and I think it adds a small but fun aspect to Tribes.

It also adds teamwork in that you can pass your repair kit to the flag carrier or someone else who needs it more.


The repair kit is an excess keybind that can be removed.

Now that mine and max mine are unbound, I have even more free keys to play around with.

I think having the rk autoactivate is the best choice. It removes the disadvantage to new players and doesn't require an extra key. This has been mentioned in previous threads, but I haven't seen a serious dev response except kp once mentioned that he liked the idea.

I think having the rk autoactivate is the best choice. It removes the disadvantage to new players and doesn't require an extra key. This has been mentioned in previous threads, but I haven't seen a serious dev response except kp once mentioned that he liked the idea.

Yea, and if a vet choosed to bind it for his own intentions and forgets to use it well ;) boo on the vet but that's his prerogative.

I still sign in on it's inclusion.

I'm against its inclusion. Its just an esoteric thing that is not essential to gameplay.