Pip?

Hm... I just can't see it being that effective.

Watching a single viewpoint is hard enough for me, watching half a dozen would just suck. Trying to write strategy on the fly and communicate it to the troops in a manner that gets it to them before it's obsolete would have me tearing my hair within minutes.

I can't see a "coach" ladder being very popular. Sure there are those who would enjoy the post of "coach". But what happens if your coach gets life on match night? Or wants to actually play in a match from time to time.

To each his own... but I doubt T:V presently supports anything remotely like this, and a mutator to perform the job might kill any box trying to run it.

Effective PiP would have to be coded in at the engine level I think. I dunno even then if it could be decent without sacrificing graphical complexity.We do have PiP for single player comms traffic, but it's not in the MP game. No reason that I know of that somebody couldn't add it though.

We do have PiP for single player comms traffic, but it's not in the MP game. No reason that I know of that somebody couldn't add it though.

For real-time rendering from a second viewpoint?

If it IS put in, I expect it to be a video resources hog.

Would it end up being a mapping thing or modding for MP?

You absolutely sure that's KP's and Thrax's mottos? Haven't they been playing the game longer than you?I fixed his post for him. :)

For real-time rendering from a second viewpoint?

If it IS put in, I expect it to be a video resources hog. Yes. We use it to show a talking head in your HUD. The "room" that the other character is in is always very simple so we only have to play the character animation. We don't show a full body, etc. Basically we keep the polys as low as possible, but it is a complete second view. I'd be interested to know if you could change the rendering settings for the PIP screen perhaps to run that at the lowest settings and keep the FPS hit at a minimum. Not sure.

Would it end up being a mapping thing or modding for MP?MOD

Yes. We use it to show a talking head in your HUD. The "room" that the other character is in is always very simple so we only have to play the character animation. We don't show a full body, etc. Basically we keep the polys as low as possible, but it is a complete second view. I'd be interested to know if you could change the rendering settings for the PIP screen perhaps to run that at the lowest settings and keep the FPS hit at a minimum. Not sure.

Believe that's how the Tribes 1 command screen interface "camera view" worked.

No one used it much then that I know of.

Believe that's how the Tribes 1 command screen interface "camera view" worked.

No one used it much then that I know of.

This is used extensivly in t1, espeically with the popularity of Viking's pack which binds full screen viewing to a key.

Viewing your flag carrier in real-time is amazingly helpful, especially in 5v5.

Yeah they have.

But take this into consideration:
Targeting Laser - scrapped due to the possibility of confusing new players.
Health Kit - scrapped because new players didn't know how to use it/one less key bind.
Jump Pads - added because new players can't move or jet without UT style of gamplay.
Auto Jump-Jet - added to cater to noobs

probably more but I don't want to turn this into a flame war.

To answer you as best as I can:

Targeting Laser - not sure why this was yanked, but oh well
Health Kit - every comp player has a script that autouses the HealthKit when health gets to a certain low point. This is exactly the same as starting you out with more health. AFAIK, dead players will still drop health. They certainly do in SP.
Jump Pads - these are used in combination with grapple in complicated maneuvers. No sense in using these for jumps when a DJ works better.
Auto Jump-Jet - Since the majority of players used a jump+jet script it suggested that this would benefit from automation. If you like in manual, you still have it.

By the way, unless this game is at least somewhat supportive of noobs, it will never have enough players to support thriving competition.

Can the camera And screen move in PIP? IE: screen is stuck on back of rover, camera stuck on pod.

Yeah they have.

But take this into consideration:
Targeting Laser - scrapped due to the possibility of confusing new players.
Health Kit - scrapped because new players didn't know how to use it/one less key bind.
Jump Pads - added because new players can't move or jet without UT style of gamplay.
Auto Jump-Jet - added to cater to noobs

probably more but I don't want to turn this into a flame war.I'm feeling magnanimous, so I'll just give you the first two. The third is in because they're fun. :shrug: If you don't like them then don't use them, but I think they're fun and I'm glad the designers have put them in. the fourth is there because it is one of the most used scripts in the game. Claiming that it is a noobificaion is like saying that adding a ski script to the game is noobifying it. If you think that is the case then I guess we'll all just have to live with that.

Things you've missed on the flip side:

Grappler - adds tremendous new movement options which require a lot of skill.
Packs - all work the same now, but all have multiple functions.
Buckler - Weapon/Shield/CQC all in one weapon. Lots to learn there.

I too could go on, but my aim is just to show that while some things have been simplified, the end product has more headroom than T1 or T2 ever could hope to have.

Thats my point.. the people who do find this fun are few and far between. Competition won't ever have this kind of position (a non player "coach") and trying to do it in pubs would drive almost anyone insane.

Ever hear of "Natural Selection"? It's a HL conversion, and part of it is similar. You place waypoints and issue orders for your team to follow for one side.

Anyway, I'm not saying that it's not a good thing, merely that it's never going to be mainstream.

Ummm I would find this fun, and I remember talk of Team Fortress 2 (lol) having a "coach" position, and the guy was like a ghost all match. I always figured that was the direction Tribes was trying to go with the command screen, but nobody ever followed up on it.

Can the camera And screen move in PIP? IE: screen is stuck on back of rover, camera stuck on pod.Can you read?

I thought I already proved i can't.

PIP as it functions in T:V is part of your HUD. It's only used in Single player. A video window opens up and other characters talk to you. At no point did the rover, pods (fighters) or cameras come into the conversation.

[QUOTE=Thrax Panda]
Buckler - Weapon/Shield/CQC all in one weapon. Lots to learn there.QUOTE]


whats CQC

Johnny X']Ummm I would find this fun, and I remember talk of Team Fortress 2 (lol) having a "coach" position, and the guy was like a ghost all match. I always figured that was the direction Tribes was trying to go with the command screen, but nobody ever followed up on it.

Trouble is that "ghost" players would just be used for spotting targets for HO/LO... turrets, inventories, etc.

Tribes WAS headed in that direction, back in T1 before skiing. Remember Command Stations? What use did you think they had? Notice that they were scrapped for T2 in favor of a "command net".


Buckler - Weapon/Shield/CQC all in one weapon. Lots to learn there.


whats CQC
Close Quarters Combat.

i think the coach position would definately be used in competition and would add a nice dimension... there are plenty of strategy oriented players who would enjoy stuff like this. if you ignore the multiple screen bit, all you'd need is a modulator that restricts the one person to observing their own team, to prevent a) spying and b) spotting for mortar spam and telling when flag is clear

Do we have camera's in the game (I'm thinking yes)? Wouldn't it be intuitive to use PiP as a means of making Camera's a useful sensor that's different then the old Pulse Sensor? If you deploy a camera, and it sees an enemy within its FOV, your PiP pops open with the camera name and what(who) its currently tracking/spying on?

Or have we already answered that question?


Camera's did have subtle functions that proved intresting enough. How many players knew that a Popup turret would use a deployed camera as its eyes? Camera's would "wake up" turrets and allow turrets to track targets before the turret itself could see a target. The popup turrets would be already deployed and aimed by the time a badguy emerged from around a corner. They'd just start blasting... and if the badguy stopped moving? They'd still keep blasting as they'd use the camera for eyes and not their motion sensors.

Camera's just had short sensor ranges, they were no good outdoors and most action takes place outdoors (in T1). Not that deployable sensors played much role at all in T1, in or outside. They were also big and clunky which made them poor spy cameras and too fragile to really survive in active enough areas. PiP could easily change that. PiP quality doesn't have to equal to your main POV/FOV resolution, you could fuzzle it and then add some graphical effect to blur it up alittle making it look like the grainy convenience store security camera views. Maybe Cameras just take a series of small, low quality picture stills that get played back at a much lower framerate in the PiP.