T3: Hooked.

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Special
04-02-2003, 16:38
It's on everybody's mind, something old Quake players miss in all the future games the try: The grappling hook. I've seen it mentioned a few times in previous posts, but I'm going to try to elaborate why I feel it should be included in the next installment of Tribes.

The map is Stonehenge. You set up for a fast route to grab the flag. You make your way over, discjumping to gain speed. The enemy tries to knock you out mid-air, but you are able to dodge them. You grab the flag and head towards the back bowl, but then you suddenly switch to your grappling hook. You fire it towards one of the posts on the flag stand, and are immediately catapulted around like a tetherball 180 degrees in the other direction. Not only did you switch directions immediately, the physics behind such a manuver granted you a huge increase in speed. Befuddled, the enemy tries to chase you but you are too far for them to catch up. However one of the enemy is just as smart as you. He discjumps in the opposite direction you are heading, and flies toward the Stonehenge. You're going NW, he heads NE. He fires his hook, and performs the same orbit manuver you pulled off, throwing him into your direction at a high speed. He fires his hook towards you, missing because he forgot to lead his shot. You continue towards your flag, 100 meters away. Because the hook needs to retract after it is shot, there is quite a lag between successive shots. He fires again, this time scoring a direct hit. He is able to grab the flag from you and return it to base. He taunts you: "How'd that feel?" Angered, you respawn and try another route.

How many times have you been skiing and you want to suddenly change direction? How about those people who try fancy flag passes, didn't you want to just grab the flag out of their hands while they tried passing it? I believe the grappling hook could add another dimension to Tribes. Much like the spinfusor it would be a staple of your inventory. The way Tribes maps are set up now would lend very nicely to the grappling hook. If you limited its usage to being able to hook to man-made objects and maybe some trees, you would still have Tribes as it used to be 90% of the time. But battles near buildings would all of a sudden become a different game. It would undoubtedly add a huge incentive to create more indoor maps to make use of the grappling hook. Spiderman-style swings, wee!

I feel, like I mentioned in my 'story' above, that the hook would need a larger recharge time. Perhaps it can feed off your energy pack much like a laser rifle would. This would limit the usage of the grappling hook because I can forsee an overusage problem with it. Aside from that it's one of the weapons I've always wanted to see put into our beloved Tribes.

DiRtNaP
04-02-2003, 16:49
Good Idea, may have to survive a beta test. I like it.

Only problem I foresee. Much like beacon hanging from the ceiling. Lets take your scenero, except hanging on the flagstand where the turret sits is someone hanging there waiting to bodyblock. I'm sure a disc could clear him, but the bodyblocking aspects seem like maybe were not thinking it all through.. Just throwing some **** out. :)

jsut
04-02-2003, 16:58
make hanging require energy, then you can't just hang indefinately.

Sanchez
04-02-2003, 18:35
nah, just hanging there with no movement is a big enough drawback.

sounds kinda like tribes with a hint of spiderman

Savage
04-02-2003, 18:46
wtf that is retarded. Wtf are you going to hook on? and why would need a grappling hook when you have ****ing JETS. JEBUS.

Bevski
04-02-2003, 19:17
goddamn yes. always thought that a grappling hook would be a good idea. imagine some of the techniques you could come up with if the physics in TTNG are as free as they are in T1? things like the HoF grappling onto a mach 5 capper and literally ripping him out of the air? or using it to slingshot a capper at warp speed onto a route? It would add a whole new chapter of style to the game and deepen it considerably.

Sir Lucius
04-02-2003, 19:55
iirc in tribes2 they were going to make is so a heavy could run into a light and knock him back -- however it was deicded aginst as the hit tests didn't set well with differing player pings (i dunno, something like that)


However this is the first convincing argument I've heard FOR the hook.

What I like about your ide
I like the idea of not beaing able to hook the gound. Just how does one hook dirt eh? Plus you'd a degree of skill and a new dimension when you add grapple routes. In that a series of objects (rocks, trees, turret stands, etc) that take the place of OR can be used in combination with a ski route.
No goround hooks take away the chance of newbies trying to escape MA's and what not by ground latching for quick dodges (plus you have total grapple whores -- quake 2 pretty much had the requirement that you constant grapple the floor for speed, and it looked pretty stupid allbeit effective).


What I don't like:
Grappling flags from people. I wouldn't like to see the hook be so slow to fire that it would take skill to grapple a flag. I also don't like the idea that people can execute pickups and returns hith a hookshot. A non-moving flag wouldn't be worthwhile to be hanging around when someone can pickup or return it with out too much trouble.

I also am not sure about hooking on to players and vechilces. This is a netcode issue, so it's not the idea, but the practicality. For a star trek explanation we can say the hook can't break through shields (insert long detailed explanation of how the player has low level shields to minimize disc explosion damage on their armor here)


Additions to your thoughts:
I think something that could slove a lot of problems would be to have damge done to the hook cuases are release in the grapple. Such that you could disc heavies off the stand by killing where they're hooked onto. If it's under a lip or something this might cuase problems so have the hook link effected by splash damage as well. This adds an intersting dimension of enemies estimating your hook target to ruin your course alteration.




That's all I have to say. Only other thoughts I have are how the rope would look (cable vs. magnetic laser light saber effect).

Gon
04-02-2003, 20:14
this is #1 idea suppoirt it 100 perent

Natural
04-02-2003, 20:33
The go-go gadget grab gone wrong.

DilLw33D
04-02-2003, 20:40
this is #1 idea suppoirt it 100 perent
i support it too! At first i was skeptic, but the scenario Special put forth was good and i think he made a lot of good points.
i vote yes on hook!

Sanchez
04-02-2003, 20:43
http://prones.virtualave.net/comand/screen23.GIF

DilLw33D
04-02-2003, 20:45
The go-go gadget grab gone wrong.
always a hater man...
****in vet^2 :rolleyes:

Sanchez
04-02-2003, 20:49
o****, anyone play the manowar TC for jedi knight, like... 6 years ago? :\

Scurvy With Fries
04-02-2003, 20:58
o****, anyone play the manowar TC for jedi knight, like... 6 years ago? :\
actualy, yes.. cool mod, I liked the gun that shot the conc bullets ultra fast.. made by same people that made bfp/bfp2.. good times :armed: :dapimp:

TricKStyLe
04-02-2003, 21:04
good idea :o

addps4cat
04-03-2003, 00:31
I think a lot of people think of grappling hook in a game as something that shoots out straight and pulls you straight. That grappling hook is in games like James Bond Agent Under Fire (the Q-hook) or in Zelda games. That kind of grappling hook would totally suck and be useless. When I think of grappling hook, I am thinking more along the lines of bionic commando; something that gives you angular momentum and rips you around in circles. That, on the other hand, would rock.

Yogi
04-03-2003, 00:43
I keep trying to beacon stop in CTF :(

snow
04-03-2003, 00:44
good idea, would probably need a lot of balencing.

if cappers can grab at a slow pace, then just grab onto something and be throw to mach 5 then its gonna be hard to chase.
also what it can grab needs to be specifically chosen, otherwise ppl can just keep using the hook as a discjump that doesnt take any health.

Darkpoint
04-03-2003, 01:05
Give it a max length, make it move about as fast as a disk. Make it so it can only attach onto buildings.

If you're coming up past the stonehenge building, you can either diskjump and get lots of speed now, or you can fire your grapple, and after 2sec, swing forward at like 1.5x running speed.

JohnClark
04-03-2003, 01:41
Fascinating idea. It would take alot of work to get right but I think that work would be well worth it.